EcoDiesel > EcoBoost

[Big Jay D]

http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2013/11/ram-1500-ecodiesel-dominates-in-real-world-fuel-economy.html

Carry on.

[Big Jay D]

Even their standard V6 beat the Ecoboost. Economy not power…

[Big Jay D]

[NorrisMike]

Interesting.

This was last months article from Motortrend. Their long term (12 mo/28,155 mi) test averaged 14.4 mpg. They went on to say they could squeak 21 mpg out of her on the hwy.

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/oneyear/trucks/1310_2012_ford_f_150_lariat_4x4_ecoboost_verdict/

[ahopkins22LSV]

Very cool. Knew about this a little bit ago from an inside source. However I don't think its worth it just yet because of the cost difference between diesel and gas at the pumps. I don't know what the price of the actual truck with the diesel in it would be either. Maybe price of diesel at the pumps will come down as more and more vehicles are built using diesel engines.

[Big Jay D]

The cool thing about the Diesel is you can delete some flow restrictions and increase the injection timing so the MPG will be even better.

My old a** 5.9 Megacab 4x4 on 35s gets 22hwy/16city. With boat on the hwy it's 16.

Diesel FTW

[TallRedRider]

Very cool. Knew about this a little bit ago from an inside source. However I don't think its worth it just yet because of the cost difference between diesel and gas at the pumps. I don't know what the price of the actual truck with the diesel in it would be either. Maybe price of diesel at the pumps will come down as more and more vehicles are built using diesel engines.

I did some simple math. Let's assume that you drove the RAM V6 diesel 100,000 miles. Diesel around my neck of the woods is $3.40. That means over 100k Miles, I would spend $13,178 in gas.

If I had a 5.3L GMC V8, spending $3 per gallon, I would spend $16,667 in gas for the same number of miles. I'm not sure that would justify the difference in cost of the engine. At least for the big engines, the diesel is an 8K upgrade. Fussing with the numbers might make it more worthwhile. Like for example, if diesel and gas were the same price, you might make up the price of the engine much sooner.

According the this, the difference in diesel and gas is even more, so the diesel engine just doesn't make sense in the first 100K miles. At least not for fuel economy. http://www.eia.gov/petroleum/gasdiesel/

It sounds like it is sort of like when I tell my wife that me hunting for deer is saving us money on meat expenses, even though I have an expensive rifle, a vehicle, and expensive ammo that far outstrips what we save on meat at the grocery store.

Edited November 19, 2013 by TallRedRider

[Tims]

The cool thing about the Diesel is you can delete some flow restrictions and increase the injection timing so the MPG will be even better.

My old a** 5.9 Megacab 4x4 on 35s gets 22hwy/16city. With boat on the hwy it's 16.

Diesel FTW

Mileage better, warranty toast! Pretty big gamble.

[Tims]

I did some simple math. Let's assume that you drove the RAM V6 diesel 100,000 miles. Diesel around my neck of the woods is $3.40. That means over 100k Miles, I would spend $13,178 in gas.

If I had a 5.3L GMC V8, spending $3 per gallon, I would spend $16,667 in gas for the same number of miles. I'm not sure that would justify the difference in cost of the engine. At least for the big engines, the diesel is an 8K upgrade. Fussing with the numbers might make it more worthwhile. Like for example, if diesel and gas were the same price, you might make up the price of the engine much sooner.

According the this, the difference in diesel and gas is even more, so the diesel engine just doesn't make sense in the first 100K miles. At least not for fuel economy. http://www.eia.gov/petroleum/gasdiesel/

It sounds like it is sort of like when I tell my wife that me hunting for deer is saving us money on meat expenses, even though I have an expensive rifle, a vehicle, and expensive ammo that far outstrips what we save on meat at the grocery store.

The difference here (east TN) is .60 cents per gal. Crazy!!!!!

Edited November 19, 2013 by Tims

[wakesetter8796]

Why does the ram hemi have a better mpg with payload than empty? And the 5.0 had a better tow mpg than the Eco.

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[Lance B. Johnson]

At least .60 cents on the gallon difference here as well. Not sure it would be worth it....

[ahopkins22LSV]

At least .60 cents on the gallon difference here as well. Not sure it would be worth it....

Same here. Sometimes I see it creep towards 1.00

[Nitrousbird]

It's all about the $$.

GM 6.2L is a 2k option vs. Ram little diesel @ $2800.

But then you have to look at the price of the trucks. MSRP vs MSRP the Ram doesn't do so well. A loaded up Laramie Limited with the diesel is about $1500 more than a GMC Sierra Denali 6.2L with similar options (well, as similar as can be, as the Denali has more stuff standard and optional to it).

Now fuel prices are lower than normal right now. Gas is @ $3.00/gallon here on average with diesel @ $3.60/gallon. Let's compare the Ram 25.8 MPG vs the 6.2L Denali 17.2MPG.

Over 100k miles:

Ram: $13,953

Denali: $17,441

Here, you get a price difference of almost $3500. So yes, you do end up making up the purchase price over 100k miles. You also get a truck that isn't as nice, much lower tow rating and a lot less power, for a savings of 2k. Not worth it IMO. Compare it to the 5.3L and the Ram looses out totally at that point. Life isn't any better comparing the Ram to the Ford camp either.

What I'd like to know is how the Chevy 6.2L gets way better fuel mileage than the same 6.2L in the GMC. Same trucks (excluding some trim/options/body panels), same motor, tranny and gear ratio, yet the result is drastically different. Let's not compare the numbers game to the Chevy High Country, which is probably more comparable to the Ram, as it is significantly less expensive.

I like the idea of the little diesel. Too bad it is wrapped around the Ram.

[Tims]

All these mileage ratings are a joke. Way too many factors and differences to get true apples to apples comparison. There are people who buy the exact same trucks and one person averages 14 and the other 19. Bottom line, you want to accelerate x amount of weight in x amount of time or speed you are going to burn x amount of fuel.

Truck makers really need to focus on getting some weight off. (I hear the new F150 will shed 800 pounds?)

Yes, a diesel goes farther on a gallon of fuel than a similar powered gas engine, but the fuel cost is now much higher, taking away much of the efficiency advantage. And you can now argue that the extra complexity of the diesel has reduced long term reliability.

My opinion, only good reason to buy a diesel is stump pulling torque. Wish the Fiat diesel has 100 lb. ft. more than it does.

[martinarcher]

I like the idea of the little diesel. Too bad it is wrapped around the Ram.

Not a Dodge fan but I hope the other two follow suit. I'd love to see a Ranger with a diesel.

[Slayer]

I think we'll see diesels continue to gain popularity here. But I agree with others, the added cost takes a long time to pay off. I'm a Ford guy at heart as many of you know however a good friend picked up a 2014 Silverado and GM has done a very nice job with that vehicle. It's the first time I can honestly say I've been impressed with a 1/2 ton GM product in decades. Now.....if only they'd pay my tax dollars back....they'd really have something, lol.

[UWSkier]

I think we'll see diesels continue to gain popularity here. But I agree with others, the added cost takes a long time to pay off. I'm a Ford guy at heart as many of you know however a good friend picked up a 2014 Silverado and GM has done a very nice job with that vehicle. It's the first time I can honestly say I've been impressed with a 1/2 ton GM product in decades. Now.....if only they'd pay my tax dollars back....they'd really have something, lol.

I can't get past the square wheel wells and the absolutely awful interior... and the bailout...

[Slayer]

I can't get past the square wheel wells and the absolutely awful interior... and the bailout...

I understand your sentiment and for the most part agree. The product improvement, to me at least, is worthy.

I still would not trade my Ford for one, though.

[Malibudude]

They have to pry my old gasser from my hands. I load up the boat and truck on earth day and blow a tank in each. I'm lucky to get 9mpg.....but it's fun to burn out through an intersection towing 6k..... Smaller diesels are here to stay and only provide another option for the public. At some point they may need to revise that out of every barrel of oil only 25% is dedicated to diesel fuel, which with an increase in supply lower prices in theory anyway.

[Big Jay D]

Why does the ram hemi have a better mpg with payload than empty? And the 5.0 had a better tow mpg than the Eco.

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A couple things about boost. It heats the air. So to cool the air you add a intercooler of sorts but the AIT is still more than ambient. Because of the added heat and ultimately the increased cylinder pressure due to boost you need more fuel and less timing to cool the cylinder enough to keep the engine from detonating. Especially with crap 87. More fuel means less MPG.

[Tims]

A couple things about boost. It heats the air. So to cool the air you add a intercooler of sorts but the AIT is still more than ambient. Because of the added heat and ultimately the increased cylinder pressure due to boost you need more fuel and less timing to cool the cylinder enough to keep the engine from detonating. Especially with crap 87. More fuel means less MPG.

Don't forget that direct injection cools cylinder as well, allowing for a 10:1 compression ratio. On boost the effective displacement of the Ecoboost is like 6.0L. That is why it does better mpg empty and worse towing. Got to pay to play. The Eco will out perform all of the v8's except for the ford and Chevy 6.2's.

[Asmodeus2112]

Not a Dodge fan but I hope the other two follow suit. I'd love to see a Ranger with a diesel.

Not sure I'd buy one, but I wish the Ranger was sold in the US. It seems like the Global-Ranger is a nice truck.

[martinarcher]

Not sure I'd buy one, but I wish the Ranger was sold in the US. It seems like the Global-Ranger is a nice truck.

The diesel Rangers in Australia I saw were pretty cool little trucks. They were more truck than the old US Ranger.

[Pnwrider]

I would still rather have the ecoboost if I was looking for a half ton. This is coming from a huge diesel fan boy.

[jwl019]

The diesel in front wasn't on the list but I can tell you it gets horrible mileage while towing. The Ford diesel being towed was having a bad day a I didn't get a chance to check the real world mileage on it, lol!