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Wakeboard Helmets for Snowboarding?


TOAST

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After reading some of the helmet threads here and a little more thought, looks like I'm coming around to the CFO's desire to get the kids into helmets this year for wakeboarding.

I'm wondering if we could use the wakeboard helmets for snowboarding in the winter. Is that a reasonable idea? I know we don't want to go the other way around - use snowboard helmets in the water because of buoyancy, water seal, etc.

Let me know what you think. . . . like to avoid buying 2 helmets/size if possible.

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We use Snowboard helmets for Wakeboarding/Kiteboarding. The Snowboard helmets have snap in ear protectors which are a handy thing in the winter. We remove them for summer fun. Submerging the helmets in water has not been an issue.

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I'd do some research on the standards that each type of helmet (snowboard/ski vs. wake) are designed to meet. Snow sports helmets typically meet ASTM 2040/CE 1077 and water helmets (kayaking) meet CE 1385.

I found one post about CE1385 that states the following:

"The most common head injury in canoeing and white water sports happens when a person strikes an underwater object after capsizing. Under these circumstances it is extremely unlikely that the speed of impact will be greater than 18 km/h (5 m/s) because this is the highest recorded rate of flow in a white water river. " Later it states that the 18 km/h corresponds to class IV waters.

It sounds like a water helmet is going to be less protective than a snow sports helmet. Speeds on snow are likely to be higher than 18 km/h and it would seem reasonable that the standards would reflect that.

You should be able to track down the standards body information on the above to get a definitive answer.

Good luck in your search,

Mike

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We use to use regular dirt bike helmets when we raced/practiced racing PWC's. They worked just fine with no real issues.

I would think that Snowboard helmets should be fine, unless there is an issue with bouyancy. Doesn't Pro-tec make helmets for both sports? maybe you could contact them and see what they say.

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Helmets are a funny issue, I read an article last month that had some intersting facts about ski helmets. Some of them could be disputed based on the sampling and a lack of information that was provided in the article but the one fact that couldn't be disputed was that the helmets were of little use when the impact speed was above 15mph.

A couple of additional facts were 18% of the ski/snowboard population used helmets. Of all ski/snowboard fatalities 65% were attributed to helmeted skiers.

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Two thoughts:

1/ The main reason I (and my kids) wear head protection for water sports is actually for EAR protection. Either snow or wakeboard helmets with ear protection (a la Protec Ace Wake model) will do the job. The ear flap should prevent a high velocity stream of water or air from entering the ear canal on a fall.

2/ Re head protection on a water sport fall. I would suspect that the main source of injury to the head during a water-sport fall is NOT with a stationary object in the water. (ie: the edge of a dock, or a ski ramp, etc.).... although that could truly be the case.... in which case a helmet may not provide much help other than to collect the mess left behind all in 1 spot.)

I would suspect it is a collision with the rider's own ski or wakeboard or ski handle. If this is the case, the "relative difference of velocity" between the 2 objects (ie: head and ski) is not the speed of the rider over the water. It's much lower. It's the speed of the rider when he hits his own ski. Usually, this is the speed at which he falls down, compared to the speed of the ski. Further, the "force" is actually directly related to the rate of deceleration (f=ma)..... all a bunch of physics formula stuff.

All that to say, I think either helmet will do the job.... in most cases.

So..... which to use: A water helmet for both.... or a snow helmet for water ???

A/ Will a snow helmet get water-soaked being used for wakeboarding, and stink, and fall apart? Maybe.

B/ Will a water helmet offer enough warmth for winter sports? Maybe.

Will both be better than no helmet? Yup!

I'd pick the helmet for the sport that would be considered the "main" sport, and use it for the "secondary" sport as well.

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Thanks for your input and suggestions.

Our 'main' sport is wakeboarding. We only get up to the slopes 3-4 times a year.

Stewart - good idea to check in with Protec. I just shot an email off to them to see if they are willing to give some advice. I'll post an update when I hear back.

I'll also see if I can get my hands on both helmets for a side-by-side comparison on the padding. Does anyone have both wake and snow helmets?

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I'd pick the helmet for the sport that would be considered the "main" sport, and use it for the "secondary" sport as well.

Or just use a batter's helmet! ;)

You mean.... like this? This was before I spent a few bucks on my Protec.

post-114-1144194844_thumb.jpg

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Then when I set the local trend a few years ago..... everybody wanted to join in on the act. All fighting to wear my Rawlings Batter Helmet.

post-114-1144195146_thumb.jpg

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Then, it became a Dock Icon.

Complete with Duct Tape "ear protection". I should have patented the idea, but alas, Protec got to mass market it before me.

post-114-1144195530_thumb.jpg

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You know, we run into this same situation in the bicycle industry, and I don't get it... Dontknow.gif ...Why are people resistant to spending a few bucks to protect their heads (not to mention the heads of their children). Bell Helmets ran an ad trying to get people to buy decent helmets for their kids instead of department store garbage. The ad was a picture of a kid sitting on a basketball, sporting the latest sneakers (nike, reebok,...whatever)...the text read - "Does your kid have $100 feet and a $10 head?"

This may seem overly confrontational (and if it does, I'm sorry, that's not how it's meant), but think about how much money you have spent on the boat, the wakeboards, bindings, ropes, vests, gloves, wetsuits,...adding the cost of helmets is nothing by comparison. Same with the snow sports. Just get the right equipment for the sports you're participating in.

[OK, off my soapbox now...]

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You know, we run into this same situation in the bicycle industry, and I don't get it... Dontknow.gif ...Why are people resistant to spending a few bucks to protect their heads (not to mention the heads of their children). Bell Helmets ran an ad trying to get people to buy decent helmets for their kids instead of department store garbage. The ad was a picture of a kid sitting on a basketball, sporting the latest sneakers (nike, reebok,...whatever)...the text read - "Does your kid have $100 feet and a $10 head?"

This may seem overly confrontational (and if it does, I'm sorry, that's not how it's meant), but think about how much money you have spent on the boat, the wakeboards, bindings, ropes, vests, gloves, wetsuits,...adding the cost of helmets is nothing by comparison. Same with the snow sports. Just get the right equipment for the sports you're participating in.

[OK, off my soapbox now...]

I think we're seeing a lot of people on this thread jumping on to the "get a helmet" bandwagon. That's a good thing. Like anything else, people are doing some homework. That's the right thing to do.

(Just in case you missed it, the "Batter's Helmet" was a temporary measure while I initially did my own homework before buying the entire family all ProTec helmets. It soon got archived, and now is a source of humor.)

If you're commenting on the folks who are simply resisting ANY kind of helmet, I agree 100% with you. Especially parents. It's their responsibility to keep their kids in 1 piece at least until they become adults. In my family "no helmet" means you just don't get to ride. Simple rule.

As for the folks that say they're not pushing too hard etc etc etc so don't need a helmet. Let me see.... who EVER plans on having an accident. (I think that's why their called "accidents".... because they weren't planned.)

When my son thumbed through his latest issue of Wakeboarding (100th issue) I shuddered noticing that 95% of the riders are helmetless. Guys flying through the air in Australia over dead-heads. A new monster rail being built in Texas..... indoor rail demonstrations.... all young guys with melons ready to get bonked. Silly.... no, just plain stupid.

As Nike ads used to say: "Do it". As per the new Starsky & Hutch movie: "Just do it". Both seem right to me.

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...If you're commenting on the folks who are simply resisting ANY kind of helmet, I agree 100% with you. Especially parents...
Sorry I wasn't clear. Yes, resistant to buying "wake" helmets because they are $40-60, and looking for a "cheaper" alternative. If you can spend forty to sixty thousand (or more) on a boat, is sixty bucks for a helmets really that much $$?

For anyone thinking that their kids won't want to wear one...once they crash wearing one and see that it takes a lot of the "smash" out of the crash...they'll wear it everytime without argument. At least that's how it happened with our boys.

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Yeah - we are definitely going to get helmets. Just considering doing double duty. Partly to not spend $$ if it is not needed, also jsut to help eliminate having extra stuff around.

I remember another Bell helmet poster that said "Got a $10 head, get a $10 helmet". Crazy.gif I'm ok buy a few helmets to cover the age ranges.

btw, I did get a hold of Pro-Tec. They said they could not legally recommend any cross use due to safety codes, regulations and liability. (I expected that) The only approved cross use of Pro-Tec products is using the BMX helmet for skating. Key differences between wake and snow:

Wake: lining for water

Snow: harder foam, designed for multiple impacts, soft lining.

The guy I spoke with definetly would NOT recommend using snow helmets in the water due to water damage, etc.

So -- All said and done, I'll buy some wake helmets now.

Thanks for all the input and perspectives!

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Where is the best place to get them?
Standard retail price for the ProTec Ace Wake is $59.99, they are available everywhere for that. You might be able to find it for a few bucks less online but then you won't be able to try it on to check for fit. If you're anywhere near a watersports retailer just buy it there. According to ProTec's advertised sizing I should wear a medium but the large is the one that fit.
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I bought a nice ProTec helmet....wore it some......felt kinda geeky :blush: .....stoped wearing it.........did a face plant......board came up and hit me in the top of the head Crazy.gif .......and wack ohhhh....blood starting gushing out........12 staples and 2 shots in the melon later Cry.gif ......now I wear my helmet all the time....... :)

http://photos.yahoo.com/mali_vride

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I bought a nice ProTec helmet....wore it some......felt kinda geeky :blush: .....stoped wearing it.........did a face plant......board came up and hit me in the top of the head Crazy.gif .......and wack ohhhh....blood starting gushing out........12 staples and 2 shots in the melon later Cry.gif ......now I wear my helmet all the time....... :)

http://photos.yahoo.com/mali_vride

THIS should be on ProTec's website.....on all their ads in Water Ski magazine ...... in Wakeboard magazine.

Talk about an effective advertorial!

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