Hard to see my VLX go... now time to pick something new!

14,084 · February 17, 2013

In regard to the 350 in the lsv, with the right prop, it's awesome in that boat. I know because my best friend is a Malibu rep, he has a 13 lsv, and he runs the 350 with 750s full in the rear and lead in the nose plus the wedge and his lsv planes. Ill get the prop numbers from him and post them up. It's not the high altitude prop, but the bigger 15 and something inch prop, which is a factory option.
Actually, I've been told by a few people who test these boats as part of their jobs that the 350 does every bit as good in the lsv as the vlx (and maybe better when you are adding ballast), because the lsv naturally planes better due to the added length of the hull. I know for a fact this principal holds true because I've been in an axis a20 weighted the exact same as another a22 with the same motor and, while the a22 planed off, the a20 would not.
Just another reason I ordered an lsv.

Thanks, Chatt. This matches very closely to what my dealer was telling me. I had a similar experience to Fman with the VLX and Acme 1235 prop... with full factory ballast, wedge, and a bunch of peeps in the boat, it struggled to get on plane. When I mentioned this my dealer he came back with the larger 15" prop option... so that is my plan regardless of which boat I choose.

The engine debate is an interesting one. You have the 5.7L that comes standard. While it's tempting to upgrade to the 6.0L in an LSV, it feels like wasting money because 1) torque curve is same, and 2) most of the LSV's I observe in OIB have 5.7's so I don't think the resale advantage is there.

Skipping over the 6.0L leaves you with the 6.2L as the only meaningful upgrade, and that costs $9k. I can't do that knowing I'll probably resale the boat sooner rather than later. I'll never get that back and it seems like overkill anyway.

So I'm 100% in the space of 5.7L Monsoon with the bigger prop. That's how my dealer has been ordering their Surf Gate LSV's and they have put tons of hours on them this way. So I think I'll be fine. Other than surfing, we'll never be adding extra weight.

14,084 · February 17, 2013

Ixfe I know you said that your wife wakeboards pretty slow... How fast does she ski? If under 30 it sounds like wake/diamond may be a moot decision except to the extent that a diamond hull makes the boat more or less attractive to a buyer. And we all know how long you keep 'em, so resale is probably a concern?
Not saying diamond will make it harder to sell either... Because they are rarer, You just might find the right buyer who is hunting for a diamond hulled lsv.
Oh and that trailer looks dope as-is. save the money on the 18s and get a couple if Telly nice surfboards instead!

My wife skis at 30 mph. I told her last night that we need to get her up into the 34 mph zone and she immediately got nervous... she associates those speeds with pros. She is recreational only. Your point about speed is valid. And I think you are asking the same question I am, which is...

Okay, we've established that Diamond doesn't hurt the wakeboard and surf experience, but does it help the ski experience enough to be worth it?

When I asked this question to the guy at Idaho Water Sports, there was a long pause on the phone. He then said, "On the 23 LSV it's not a good ski experience regardless."

So perhaps it's not worth it the hassle. Yes, resale is HUGE to me. It guides almost every decision I make when it comes to picking options. I'm still of the mindset that nobody will ever know or ask about Diamond hull when I sell.

As for the wheels, we'll have to agree to disagree on that. Those 14's under that L O N G boat look anemic to me, just all out of proportion. But you are right... I need new surf boards. And I'm not convinced the 18's helped my resale on the VLX, so...

February 17, 2013

If resale is big, go with the wake hull. IMO more people want the wake hull on the LSV than the diamond. It didn't come up before, but doesn't mean it can't come up in the future. What about colors. Metal flake or is it too spendy?

4,586 · February 17, 2013

Thanks, Chatt. This matches very closely to what my dealer was telling me. I had a similar experience to Fman with the VLX and Acme 1235 prop... with full factory ballast, wedge, and a bunch of peeps in the boat, it struggled to get on plane. When I mentioned this my dealer he came back with the larger 15" prop option... so that is my plan regardless of which boat I choose.
The engine debate is an interesting one. You have the 5.7L that comes standard. While it's tempting to upgrade to the 6.0L in an LSV, it feels like wasting money because 1) torque curve is same, and 2) most of the LSV's I observe in OIB have 5.7's so I don't think the resale advantage is there.
Skipping over the 6.0L leaves you with the 6.2L as the only meaningful upgrade, and that costs $9k. I can't do that knowing I'll probably resale the boat sooner rather than later. I'll never get that back and it seems like overkill anyway.
So I'm 100% in the space of 5.7L Monsoon with the bigger prop. That's how my dealer has been ordering their Surf Gate LSV's and they have put tons of hours on them this way. So I think I'll be fine. Other than surfing, we'll never be adding extra weight.

With a 15" prop can you tow a slalom skier at 32-34 mph at a reasonable rpm range? I know with the acme 1235 I was pushing 4200+ rpms when towing a slalom skier. The motor was definitely feeling it... I would think it would even be higher with a lower pitched prop?

1,209 · February 17, 2013

I thought I had read that the diamond hull was the standard hull on the 23.

4,586 · February 17, 2013

Another thought on wake vs diamond hull. If there was zero difference in wakes, why would Malibu just not make everything with the diamond hull? There has to be some noticeable wakeboard wake differences between the two or it would make no sense to offer two different hulls.

1 Boat · February 17, 2013

My wife skis at 30 mph. I told her last night that we need to get her up into the 34 mph zone and she immediately got nervous... she associates those speeds with pros. She is recreational only. Your point about speed is valid. And I think you are asking the same question I am, which is...
Okay, we've established that Diamond doesn't hurt the wakeboard and surf experience, but does it help the ski experience enough to be worth it?
When I asked this question to the guy at Idaho Water Sports, there was a long pause on the phone. He then said, "On the 23 LSV it's not a good ski experience regardless."
So perhaps it's not worth it the hassle. Yes, resale is HUGE to me. It guides almost every decision I make when it comes to picking options. I'm still of the mindset that nobody will ever know or ask about Diamond hull when I sell.
As for the wheels, we'll have to agree to disagree on that. Those 14's under that L O N G boat look anemic to me, just all out of proportion. But you are right... I need new surf boards. And I'm not convinced the 18's helped my resale on the VLX, so...

I haven't noticed many diamond hulls at IWS, but I haven't visited in a while either. My guess is you'd reach more buyers with a diamond hulled LSV. I'd think someone who wants a bigger boat, geared more towards wakeboarding, would take a longer look at the MXZ series.

Congrats on the sale. I've noticed a few boats on the forum have sold very quickly lately

1 Boat · February 17, 2013

If resale is big, go with the wake hull. IMO more people want the wake hull on the LSV than the diamond. It didn't come up before, but doesn't mean it can't come up in the future. What about colors. Metal flake or is it too spendy?

Maybe its a territory difference but you guys are backwards on the Wake vs. Diamond hulls. I had trouble selling my VLX with Wake hull. I was asked if it was on the diamond hull several times.. In fact someone liked my boat so much they ordered Identical colors but on a Diamond hull...

I won't ever order a wake hull again...

These are family boats and maybe there are a higher percentage of people up here that still enjoy recreational skiing but our Dealer only orders Diamond hull for their stock inventory. If there is a difference in the Wakeboard wakes it is not something myself or the majority of people will notice and I don't plan on going pro anytime soon...

1 Boat · February 17, 2013

I have the diamond hull and posted a couple picks of the wake on the other thread you started. I ski at about 33 - 34 mph and I find the wake great. I pull skiers anywhere from 28 - 35 mph and the wake is nice and soft through that range. I was specifically looking for the diamond hull as I wanted the best all around boat I could find. I went from a 21 foot Centurion to the 23 LSV and the space difference was huge to us. We have anywhere from 6 to 12 out with us on most trips and everyone is comfortable with plenty of space for gear.

I have the stock 350 with stock prop and have never have an issue. I do only use factory ballast though but have pulled a 230 lbs slalom skier up with no problem at all. I am about 185 lbs and pop right up with the stock prop. Top end for my boat is about 42 - 43 mph. We are generally using the boat at sea level but we do spend a week or so each year in North Idaho around 3,000 feet and didn't really notice a difference.

We also surf with just the stock ballast and everyone is able to go rope less but being another 6 feet back would be great. Wish I had the surf gate.

Just put a good coat of wax on the Denali and it will be fine for a few months outside. The Denali will also really like towing the 23.

Kris

1,209 · February 18, 2013

I haven't noticed many diamond hulls at IWS, but I haven't visited in a while either. My guess is you'd reach more buyers with a diamond hulled LSV. I'd think someone who wants a bigger boat, geared more towards wakeboarding, would take a longer look at the MXZ series.
Congrats on the sale. I've noticed a few boats on the forum have sold very quickly lately

I have noticed that as well - non surf gate boats have been selling like hot cakes lately. Just goes to show that people want malibus, with or without surfgate.

3 Boats · February 18, 2013

IXFE - Congrats on your boat sale! I have seen it in person its a nice ride...

On height clearance - my LSV just arrived a couple weeks ago and I got it on a Ryan trailer. It sits a couple inches lower I'd say, Gerry could tell you how much for sure.

Monsoon 350 - Yeah go for it, I was really disappointed when my 6.0 arrived with no warming tray. Maybe doesn't mean anything to some folks but to me to pay more money and lose a feature is a real bummer. I saw the LSV plane with 6 guys, 2x 750, and 400 pound sack. It took maybe 15 seconds before the wave really setup right, but it got there. And who knows if the 6.0 would really do it any faster.

VLX vs LSV - I chose LSV, you know dealer likes the LSV better, and it seems to be the internet favorite... BUT, we have seen great looking VLX waves and with your storage issues I think I would seriously consider going that route. VLX is a damn sexy boat. I don't think Gerry ever got the VLX wave dialed but he had a lot more time in the LSV to figure it out. Maybe call the Seattle shop they had some nice looking VLX waves with SG as I recall.

Cheers man, good luck on your decisions! Let me know if you want to poke around my boat once we get it finished, we are making a few more mods that might be worth copying

Edited February 18, 2013 by pkh

14,084 · February 18, 2013

Wow... great inputs from all of you. Even my family has enjoyed reading your input, and it truly has helped us organize our thoughts.

Here's what I'm sure of...

The Diamond hull feels like a no-brainer for our purposes. I remember facing this dilemma last year, and we chose the Wake hull with resale in mind. I'm not convinced it made any difference. So this year I think we'll try something different.
Not that there was much of a debate, but the Monsoon 350 is what we'll order again. But I'm going to give the new 15" prop a whirl. Can't hurt. If we don't like it, I'm sure the dealer would let me swap it for a 1235.
I'm going to try to see if Boatmate can lower the bunks a few inches so the 18's will work on the LSV.

Here's what I have yet to decide...

VLX vs. LSV: I'm leaning heavily towards LSV. It just feels like the right boat for us. But not everybody in the family is convinced.
Bags: Still debating Plug-n-Play vs. aftermarket bags/pumps in the lockers. Even if aftermarket doesn't fill faster, I believe it will empty better/flatter with the impeller pumps. A lot depends on the cost... need to get quote from dealer.
Colors: More on that below...

14,084 · February 18, 2013

Main colors: We like black and/or white for main colors. But not too much white. In fact, everybody in the family is telling me no white at all. I'm the one trying to preserver some of it (mainly for cost purposes and it looks good behind our white tow rig).

Accents colors: We like silver or red. We have thought about riskier colors like vapor blue (I'm the only one who likes it) and Monster Green (wish it was more "lime" like. But silver and red seem to be the favorites.

So here are my favorite schemes. Please post yours!

Only upgrade $$ here would be black hull, unless we did the red accent in flake.

This would be expensive with black hull, black top deck, and three sections of silver flake.

Edited February 18, 2013 by IXFE

2,295 · February 18, 2013

#2 is the money shot. Having had several all black/dark boats, they look sooo nice, but I really am getting tired of the upkeep. I have thousands of dollars in cleaning and buffing supplies. Not so much into it anymore.

February 18, 2013

Edited February 18, 2013 by skurfer

14,084 · February 18, 2013

IXFE - Congrats on your boat sale! I have seen it in person its a nice ride...
On height clearance - my LSV just arrived a couple weeks ago and I got it on a Ryan trailer. It sits a couple inches lower I'd say, Gerry could tell you how much for sure.
Monsoon 350 - Yeah go for it, I was really disappointed when my 6.0 arrived with no warming tray. Maybe doesn't mean anything to some folks but to me to pay more money and lose a feature is a real bummer. I saw the LSV plane with 6 guys, 2x 750, and 400 pound sack. It took maybe 15 seconds before the wave really setup right, but it got there. And who knows if the 6.0 would really do it any faster.
VLX vs LSV - I chose LSV, you know dealer likes the LSV better, and it seems to be the internet favorite... BUT, we have seen great looking VLX waves and with your storage issues I think I would seriously consider going that route. VLX is a damn sexy boat. I don't think Gerry ever got the VLX wave dialed but he had a lot more time in the LSV to figure it out. Maybe call the Seattle shop they had some nice looking VLX waves with SG as I recall.
Cheers man, good luck on your decisions! Let me know if you want to poke around my boat once we get it finished, we are making a few more mods that might be worth copying

What made you opt for a Ryan trailer over the Boatmate. I know Ryan's are made locally... did that save you some cash? Or did you do it specifically for the height clearance.

I demo'd the VLX Surf Gate with Gerry back in October. It was fine... just not as good as the LSV. I think we only had 400's in the locker though. And only two guys in the boat.

Is your new boat here? I want to see it! Let's hook up!!

1,209 · February 18, 2013

I like number 1. Very similar to what we were thinking of doing on ours before going driftwood and black. I don't care for number 2.

14,084 · February 18, 2013

I don't know Bryan, that's a lot of red as a main color.

I did experiment a bit and make a copy of Marc's new boat, only replace the yellow with red. I think the white hull softens it up a bit. Still not my favorite though.

February 18, 2013

I like them all. I think your 1st one is safer than your second. Red flake. There is a guy on the MC site, he has pics of his X-Star going through the factory. It's black and Canadian blue flake. I like the MC blue flake a bit better than BU's. Went with the same concept except red flake.

Edited February 18, 2013 by skurfer

3 Boats · February 18, 2013

IXFE - We had some rust issues with our Boatmate trailer last year, and I just wasn't happy with how they handled it (they didn't warranty it.) It was only a year old trailer and to see rust developing already was just unacceptable IMO. http://www.themalibucrew.com/forums/index.php?/topic/27779-trailer-recommendation/page-2

Really happy with how the Ryan trailer turned out, came with all the same features as the Boatmate, and I am stoked to support a local company. Cost was about the same if I recall correctly.

Yeah boat is here but not quite ready yet, its having tower speakers installed right now. Then should be back at AWS mid this week. Hope to water test after that, you should come check it out for sure!

1,329 · February 18, 2013

Wow... great inputs from all of you. Even my family has enjoyed reading your input, and it truly has helped us organize our thoughts.
Here's what I'm sure of...
The Diamond hull feels like a no-brainer for our purposes. I remember facing this dilemma last year, and we chose the Wake hull with resale in mind. I'm not convinced it made any difference. So this year I think we'll try something different.
Not that there was much of a debate, but the Monsoon 350 is what we'll order again. But I'm going to give the new 15" prop a whirl. Can't hurt. If we don't like it, I'm sure the dealer would let me swap it for a 1235.
I'm going to try to see if Boatmate can lower the bunks a few inches so the 18's will work on the LSV.
Here's what I have yet to decide...
VLX vs. LSV: I'm leaning heavily towards LSV. It just feels like the right boat for us. But not everybody in the family is convinced.
Bags: Still debating Plug-n-Play vs. aftermarket bags/pumps in the lockers. Even if aftermarket doesn't fill faster, I believe it will empty better/flatter with the impeller pumps. A lot depends on the cost... need to get quote from dealer.
Colors: More on that below...

I have a 15 inch prop on my Monsoon equipped VLX and while it has some advantages, the hole shot is a little down vs the 1235. This is just a "gut" observation, but I think that overall surface area of the 15 inch prop is just a little much for the SB chevy. Most of the prop tests still show the 1235 on top for delivering best hole shot while still having enough top speed to ski. I suggest having a conversation with ACME in order to find the best match for your needs.

February 18, 2013

If you want to talk to my friend who is a rep and who owns an lsv with the 15 inch prop, let me know and ill pm you his cell. I accidentally ordered my lsv with the 1235, and when he saw that prop on my build sheet, he immediately called the factory and had the order modified to swap the 1235 for the 15. I also had a long discussion with another engineer at bu who explained that the 15 was the best prop by far for running extra weight.

February 18, 2013

Not trying to hijack, but is there any way to tell a diamond from the wake hulls by looking at the boat? I bought mine and that was the ONLY thing I forgot to ask. I'd like to know. Can't believe I forgot to ask.

February 18, 2013

Not trying to hijack, but is there any way to tell a diamond from the wake hulls by looking at the boat? I bought mine and that was the ONLY thing I forgot to ask. I'd like to know. Can't believe I forgot to ask.

http://www.themalibucrew.com/forums/index.php?/page/articles.html/_/diamond-vs-wake-hull-r9

February 18, 2013

http://www.axiswakeboardboats.com/download/file.php?id=1408

Saw this pic and thought it looked similar to something you'd like.

Edited February 18, 2013 by Chattwake

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Hard to see my VLX go... now time to pick something new!

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