Modified Wake Makers Piggy Back Installation

[Phoenix]

After having some issues with draining my piggy back fat sacs, and with some input from Happy 2 Ride (Thanks H2R), I have modified my Wake Makers piggy back installation.

Here are the steps, with pictures of my work. Note, this is installed in a 2012 VTX, so should work in most 2012's. I don't know about the 11's or earlier.

I would clasify this as a fairly easy modification. I got scared at the beginning thinking the Phiranna pumps were 1-1/8" inlets, but once I realized it was all 3/4" fittings, things went well.

The project started with the Wake Makers kit, then modified the installation steps. Here is my BOM (per side) for the installation:

• 1 Wake Makers 2012 Piggy Back installation kit
  
• 1 x 1" TEE
  
• ~1½' of 1-1/8" ballast hose
  
• 1 x 3/4" threaded tee (from Home Depot)
  
• 2 x 3/4" threaded M-M couplers (from HD)
  
• 1 x 3/4" thread to 1" Barb coupler (90°) (from HD)
  

Vent Line

The Vent line is similar to the original installation. Using a "Y" connector, cut into the vent line right by the through hull. One branch returns to the hard tank, and the second branch to the fat sac.

To find the vent line, locate the access hatch near the front of the rear locker.

I undid the one screw closest to me, and then rotated the top cover.

There are two hoses that enter the tank here. One is the fill line that comes from the anti-siphoning valve, the other the vent line that goes directly to the through hull fitting.

Follow the vent hose to the fitting and disconnect at the through hull. I needed to get the hair dryer out to loosen up the hose.

Using the "Y" connector and hose supplied by WakeMakers, connect it to the through hull fitting. Cut some of the existing hose off the original vent line, then connect it to the remaining outlet on the "Y" fitting.

Advice from Happy 2 Ride, make sure these vent lines both stay high so that the hard tank will fill first before the soft tank.

Fill Line

Next, I installed a "Tee" connection on my fill line right before it enters the ballast.

Finding the fill line, locate the anti-siphoning valve then follow the hose to the tank. I cut the hose ~4" from the inlet so that the tee would not interfere with the engine divider.

The fill hose for the fat sac was then connected to the tee and routed above the existing hoses. You may find it easier to remove the grey capreted piece to access the hoses crossing from the engine compartment to the side of the hull.

The first picture shows the anti-siphone valve and the tee connector.

Second picture shows a closer view of the tee connector.

Again, similar to the vent line, ensure that the fill hose for the fat sac is routed high enough so that the hard tank will fill first.

Drain Line

The drain pump can be found in the rear hatch located at the back of locker.

My steps here were:

1. Remove the existing drain hose (again, get the hair dryer out to help loosen the hose)
   
2. Disconnect the pump electrical wires (quick connect located just inside the engine compartment on the rear wall)
   
3. Unscrew the pump from the drain outlet of the hard tank
   
4. Install threaded tee connection (picture and description below)
   
5. Install 1" inlet onto the tee connection (you will not be able to pre-install this before the tee is installed)
   
6. Screw the drain pump back onto the threaded tee
   
7. Re-connect the wires and drain hose
   
8. Connect new hose for fat sac drain to 1" inlet and route to the fat sac.
   

The threaded tee was picked up from Home Depot. It is a 3/4" threaded tee (all three points). I then picked up two 3/4" threaded joiners, and 1 right angle 3/4" thread to 1" barb connector.

Below is what the combination of pieces look like.

Below is what the rear hatch looks like once it's all back together.

I managed to route the drain hose out the gap between the compartment wall and the read wall of the hull, so I didn't have to make any cuts (yet).

Now that the installation has been finished, I still need to test this all. If we ever see the sun again in this province, I will go out and test everything before completing the other side.

Cheers,

Don

[jgriffn]

Thanks for the write up and pictures. I think I will rig mine up like this once I get the parts in so I will not have the draining issue. Let us know how it works once you get out and test it.

[Happy to ride]

Look good. I did not have to unhook the pump wires, I removed the screw and blue ring then motor, but the rest is pretty much how I did mine. I turned the sac so the drain is to the rear of the locker, to keep the hose short, and used ring clamps on the hoses at the sac so as not to put a hole in the sac. Let us know how yours work for you.

[itsonlywater]

How is the system working? Any issues?

[pkh]

Sorry for stupid question, but after this are the MLS gauges still accurate and are you able to control everything through MLS controls?

[Phoenix]

How is the system working? Any issues?

The system works, however I have a new issue. When draining, and the hard tank reaches about 25%, the drain pump starts sucking air and won't completely drain the hard tank. I will have to look at a valve or something here to help with the draining.

Sorry for stupid question, but after this are the MLS gauges still accurate and are you able to control everything through MLS controls?

Not a stupid question.

The reason I went with the piggy back tanks was because I wanted to keep my MLS controls. The guages will show what is in the hard tanks. Once those tanks are full (100%) the soft tanks start filling and there is no guage to go with those.

For surfing I don't really need to have a display to show what level the tanks are at. As a beginner/intermediate boarder I do care as I am working my way up from the bottom for wakeboarding.

[Happy to ride]

Sorry Phoenix, I should have told you that you will get a little air, but I am in the locker holding up the bag to get "ALL" the water out and when the sac is dry I unhock the sac and put my plug in the drain hose and the air problem goes away. A valve would work also but I do not have the room between the pump and sac. I only get air at the very last little bit of the hard tank, but it will still drain down, I only unhock to finish alittle faster. Does the setup work better now or before the change?

[Phoenix]

Does the setup work better now or before the change?

Thanks Happy!

Yes, the new set up is much better.

I'm doing the same steps you are at the end, which is why I'm contemplating a valve to save stuffing my finger in the hose at the end of the day.

Cheers,

Don

[Iron gator]

I just installed the 750 piggy back system and have a draining issue. I was thinking of putting something under the sacks to raise them up a few inches and possibly tilt them forward a little. Any thoughts?

[Phoenix]

I just installed the 750 piggy back system and have a draining issue. I was thinking of putting something under the sacks to raise them up a few inches and possibly tilt them forward a little. Any thoughts?

Hi Iron Gator,

This was the reason I changed the installation the way I did. Using WM's installation directions I would end up with an almost full soft tank while my hard tanks were empty. Connecting the drains together and rotating the fat sac has helped tremendously.

I have read other comments about using a really short drain hose, but I found that still wasn't helping.

I haven't resorted to needing to plug the drain line as I find if I'm under power that the tanks manage to drain completely.

Cheers,

Don

[Malibuzer]

I just installed the 750 piggy back system and have a draining issue. I was thinking of putting something under the sacks to raise them up a few inches and possibly tilt them forward a little. Any thoughts?

That is what i used to do. Just a life jacket under the one end made a difference. I really like the setup that Brett B has come up with.

[Tanglin]

Running 1100lbs sacs in 2012 VLX and took a slightly different approach to Piggy Backing the sacs into MLS . For a small additional cost I had the sacs made with an extra drain outlet at the bottom beside the standard one.

Removed the rear Ballast tanks and had 3 fittings put into the rear of them - two at the top in the centre and one down in the bottom corner beside the existing drain fitting .- did by spin welding threaded fittings.

The sac is then plumbed into the hard tank via the two new fittings at the back of the tank. With two 1 inch hoses the bag fills (and drains) much more quickly once the hard ballast is full compared to the usual piggy back system, and I also don’t have the problem of air getting into the drain pump if you tee off the drain pump as suggested elsewhere.

I then added two more fill pumps teed off the existing T-drain hole beside the sump and ran them via anti siphons to the existing vent inlets on the tanks. The sacs now act as the vent lines. Attached two additional pumps to the additional drain holes at the back of the tanks - had to connect via short length of hose and have them in the bilge to ensure the water drains down to them and no airlocks.

The second drain hose runs up beside the first and teed into the vent hose so as no need to drill holes. Just put a check valve on the vent hose from the bag to stop flow back towards the bag.

The pumps are wired in parallel to the existing pumps so they operate offMTC MLS I now have the back ballast tanks running at 2200GPH Once the hard tanks are full i just touch the switch again to fill the bags and stop when it flows out the vent.

Speeds up the fill and drain process to less than 5 mins and if I throw a Tsunami into the bag we are down to 3- 4 mins.

With the two drain hoses at the back the Bag drains quickly and any last water runs out as we head for home and the boat is up on the plane.

Moved the Battery out of the locker to keep clean - Stiffened up on the engine dividers .

If I was really serious I would drill two additional intake holes in the hull and two more vent holes in the side so as to not need to tee off hoses.

[Iron gator]

I think I might try connecting the drains together as well as tilting the bags towards the rear. thanks!

[spencer]

Phoenix,

That system must have lit a fire for Malibu. Your design is very similar to the Plug & Play option on 2013 Malibu boats. I really like the ability to drain from the back of the sac directly to the pump. This sure makes me want to look at our WM piggy back design. Enjoy the rest of your summer boys and girls.

Thanks,

[Happy to ride]

I knew I should have called Malibu with the idea. I would love to see what they came up with.

[mblaza]

Installed the piggy back (750lb sac) ballast system from wakemakers.com on my 06 VLX. Was a bit concerned about draining time and if the bags would drain completly after reading a few threads. I have run my for 2 year now without a prob.

[nownow]

Reviving this thread.

I installed the piggyback on Tuesday and immediately went to this setup yesterday. The soft bag (Sumo 900) drained most of the way pretty quickly (maybe 10-12 minutes before it stopped) but probably left about 1-1.5 inches in the bottom of the bag. My bag is seems a little strange, with a fill and vent at the top all the way near the front (I'd sure prefer top center) and a drain in the bottom back. That said, the drain is up against the access panel for the pump (left side) and isn't all the way at the back of the locker. Might that be part of the problem?

1) Is it normal to have an inch or so of water left in the soft bag? Will I still have to hold it up or roll it up to drain it all the way? Do I just need to put something under the front of it?

2) Will draining while underway help to completely drain the soft bag?

3) Are a 12 minute fill and 12 minute drain about normal for this setup?

I should say that it's an early 2012, so I still have the smaller 3/4" stock hoses.

Thanks...Jason

[Dave K]

The drain plug placement on that sac looks to be quite low so I wouldn't thing the pump should have a hard time picking up water. What I did with my 750 sac is used a W742 90 degree quick release connector, a 9" piece of hose which is then connected to a Piranha pump. The pump is just on the engine side of the plastic compartment divider. Seems to work ok. The only other thing and I don't mean to be sarcastic but do you empty all bags at once? If your just floating while bags empty maybe (heavy) bow sacs are making front lower than back??

Just kick it into forward and pop bow up a bit to move all the water to the back of the sacs so the pump can pick it up. We are pretty much always moving while ballast empties, whether its 5 mph or 30 mph.

Edited August 2, 2013 by Dave K

[nownow]

Thanks. I do drain them all at once, and we don't have any extra ballast in the bow...just factory which drains quickly.

We were out last night and moving definitely helps some. We'll typically sit and swim while we're draining, but we may just have to amend that a little bit. I'm also wondering if I need to rework the tee connection. My drain hose from the bag ends up coiled up a little back there because I'm going in through the slot between the pump compartment cover and the engine divider, not through the slot between the pump compartment and the rear of the hull. I may end up with a riser off of the tee and then go out by the rear of the hull...I think that might make things fit just a little better for me and it'll cut out a fair amount of hose.

I also may try to re-run all of this in 1" hose, too. I assume that would help some.

[edsvlx]

Man that was good pictures, great details,the people on this crew are great. Thanks to everyone.

[MarshallGreen]

Can you show pictures of how you modified your fill and drain hatches to allow hoses to run to sacs? Or did you just discard hatch covers?