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jrad12381

Alternate Amps To Run Rev 10's Or Exile Xm9's

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jrad12381

I am trying to peice together the stereo for my MXZ so when it arrives I can get it knocked out this spring. I plan on running 2 pairs of tower speakers. I have read that the exile harpoon can run the XM9's fairly well, and I have hear 1 syn 4 can run 2 pairs of REV 10's good, but tw2 syn 4's will run the REV 10's much better. I am on a budget so ideally I want to stick with running one amp for my tower speakers. Doeas anyone have input on what amps would run these tower speakers very well, and if so at what ohms, and wiring configuration? I have read the audio arc ks600.2 is a great amp, and makes great power, but I am unsure if this amp would push the speakers better than the amps listed above. Any input on other amps, or more info on the audio arc amp would be great. Hopefully this post doesnt cause any vendor issues, I am just trying to educate myself before I spend my hard earned money. Feel free to PM me with info as well.

Thanks

Jared

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Bobby Light

Short answer. For 2 sets of tower speakers (4 total) I'd run either the ARC 600.2 for 600x2 at 2 ohms (300 watts x 4) or the Exile Harpoon at 500x2 at 2 ohms (250 watts x 4). I wouldn't consider the others for 4 tower speakers since you're on a budget and want to stick to one amp. If you wanted to run 2 amps that opens up a whole new list of options but raises the budget substantiantially.

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Murphy8166

I am trying to peice together the stereo for my MXZ so when it arrives I can get it knocked out this spring. I plan on running 2 pairs of tower speakers. I have read that the exile harpoon can run the XM9's fairly well, and I have hear 1 syn 4 can run 2 pairs of REV 10's good, but tw2 syn 4's will run the REV 10's much better. I am on a budget so ideally I want to stick with running one amp for my tower speakers. Doeas anyone have input on what amps would run these tower speakers very well, and if so at what ohms, and wiring configuration? I have read the audio arc ks600.2 is a great amp, and makes great power, but I am unsure if this amp would push the speakers better than the amps listed above. Any input on other amps, or more info on the audio arc amp would be great. Hopefully this post doesnt cause any vendor issues, I am just trying to educate myself before I spend my hard earned money. Feel free to PM me with info as well.

Thanks

Jared

I would give Brad a call at Arc Audio and ask him about the 600.2 This amp was desinged for folks that were running some serious tower speakers. There is more than meets the eye this amp and it really has to do with the power supply. The power supply is that same one that Arc is using in their SE amps which are MUCH more expensive and top of the line!

I know a couple BIG installers out in Cali (Chucktronics) that rave about this amp and have used a couple of them when putting 10 Rev 10's on a tower.

I have not first hand experience with the Exile amp so I don't feel like I could make a comment on those.

Good luck and say goodbye to your hearing!!!

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Murphy8166

As far as wiring goes the Arc 600.2 is a 2 channel amp so you could wire it a couple of ways. You could run a 12 awg from each speaker on the right and connect them into same postive and negative on the right channel of the amp and then you could put both 12 awg wire from the left side spekers in to the left channel of the amp.

You could also run a jumper wire from right speaker one on to right speaker two and then run one set of 12 awg to the right channel on the amp. Do the same thing with the left side.

With 4 speakers and than 2 channel amp - you amp would see a 2 ohm load.

Edited by Murphy8166

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shawndoggy

I'm running two pairs of Rev10s from a single Arc ks600.2. It's LOUD and clear.

That said, Ben at Acme Tops and Tunes in Sac recommends putting a 600.2 on each pair. Even at 300w per speaker, you run out of amp before you run out of speaker performance with the Rev10s. For family use, one 600.2 on two pairs of Rev10s is more than plenty. If you want to be the loudest person in the cove, I guess you might want to put one on each pair.

I'm very pleased with the sound quality of the Rev10s in the boat. Had bullet hollowpoints on the old boat and they could be a little harsh to listen to in the cabin. The Revs are very smooth in and out of the boat. The true test for me is whether I can hear them when I'm behind the boat. The bullets were plenty loud to hear from 70', but I rarely got to hear them because my wife wouldn't turn 'em that loud because they'd rip her head off in the boat (illusion tower's less than optimal mounting positions also had something to do with that). With the revs, no prob, she'll let 'em rip. New boat has higher and farther back mounting position too, so that also probably has something to do with it.

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cowwboy

Running one 600.2 per pair isn't really worth it.

By running a 600.2 at 4ohm per channel gives you 400w to each enclosure(one amp per pair).

Where as if you run a pair of enclosures to each channel you'll get 300w per enclosure(one amp for both pairs).

So double your amplifier costs for 100w???

Personally I would run the 600.2 for both pairs.

Arc's are under rated also so 300w per enclosure is being A very conservative number.

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shawndoggy

Running one 600.2 per pair isn't really worth it.

By running a 600.2 at 4ohm per channel gives you 400w to each enclosure(one amp per pair).

Where as if you run a pair of enclosures to each channel you'll get 300w per enclosure(one amp for both pairs).

So double your amplifier costs for 100w???

Personally I would run the 600.2 for both pairs.

Arc's are under rated also so 300w per enclosure is being A very conservative number.

What I was told by Ben is that there is a significant benefit to dynamic headroom beyond what an additional 100w would suggest. Other respected installers told me two pair on the one amp would be fine (but that having their own amps would be more better).

That said, I'm running the speakers as you suggest (two pairs on a single ks600.2 @ 2ohms) and I'm happy with the sound. Just trying to recount what I've been told for the benefit of the board.

Doesn't sound like you've actually tried it either?

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Murphy8166

What about a JL Audio HD 1200/1

Could that run 4 Rev 10's

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shawndoggy

What about a JL Audio HD 1200/1

Could that run 4 Rev 10's

I'm pretty sure there was a thread on wakeworld about that one and there's a substantial high pass rolloff. Like it cuts off at 14k rather than 20k. It's not a true full range amp.

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nyryan2001

I have been doing my research on this over the last week, as I am about to fall into the same category. 2 pairs of Rev10s or, 1 pair Rev10s and 1Pair Pro80s. Putting that much speaker on your tower underpowered can be considered nothing less than communist.

The Fosgate T1000-4 seems to fit perfectly for 2 pair. It will put out a true tested 325 watts per speaker (650w per pair) at 14V x 4 when bridged a 2ohms x 2 channels. Check out the dynamic tested ratings:

The only other thing I will add is that it is class AD, vs AB, so it"ll suck less juice than a regular 2 channel amp comparitively, ie 80% efficient at 2 ohms bridged vs the 60-70% efficiency of an AB. Cost is around $610 shipped from sonicelectronix

Rated Power

(RMS Continuous Power) 250 Watts x 4 @ 4-Ohm

250 Watts x 4 @ 2-Ohm

250 Watts x 4 @ 1-Ohm

500 Watts x 2 @ 4-Ohm Bridged

500 Watts x 2 @ 2-Ohm Bridged

Total Power

(Sum of Rated Power) 1000 Watts RMS

Dynamic Power

(PVC/PowerCube® Measurement) 250 Watts x 4 @ 4-Ohm

325 Watts x 4 @ 2-Ohm

360 Watts x 4 @ 1-Ohm

610 Watts x 2 @ 4-Ohm Bridged

650 Watts x 2 @ 2-Ohm Bridged

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Wakesetter67

I'm also going to change up my tower, Going with 4 Exile XM9's, If I'm not mistaken, Wouldn't you want to run two Harpoons for the 9's or would you notice that much differance just going with the single Harpoon,

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my malibu

also going with 4 xm 9 s

Considering adding another harpoon but I'm running out of space

I'm also going to change up my tower, Going with 4 Exile XM9's, If I'm not mistaken, Wouldn't you want to run two Harpoons for the 9's or would you notice that much differance just going with the single Harpoon,

Edited by my malibu

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Wakesetter67

also going with 4 xm 9 s

Considering adding another harpoon but I'm running out of space

Well Both Brian And Dave Said 1 harpoon would work Great, I'm going to try it this way, I can Always add another Amp, But it's getting Tight in my Storage Compartment, I currently have two battery's, 3 Exile amps, and a Pro Mariner Charger, I know i can Fit another, I would just have to relocate the Pro mariner somewhere else.. Should have the simple Install Done In Jan.

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Bake's Marine

Well Both Brian And Dave Said 1 harpoon would work Great, I'm going to try it this way, I can Always add another Amp, But it's getting Tight in my Storage Compartment, I currently have two battery's, 3 Exile amps, and a Pro Mariner Charger, I know i can Fit another, I would just have to relocate the Pro mariner somewhere else.. Should have the simple Install Done In Jan.

You could move your batteries to the walk thru like Liljohn did... I thought that was a awesome mod and now his passenger compartment has tons of room. (he fit two SRM27's and one SRM24 in the walk thru and mounted the prosport charger in there as well.

-Paul

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TallRedRider

I'm running two pairs of Rev10s from a single Arc ks600.2. It's LOUD and clear.

That said, Ben at Acme Tops and Tunes in Sac recommends putting a 600.2 on each pair. Even at 300w per speaker, you run out of amp before you run out of speaker performance with the Rev10s. For family use, one 600.2 on two pairs of Rev10s is more than plenty. If you want to be the loudest person in the cove, I guess you might want to put one on each pair.

I'm very pleased with the sound quality of the Rev10s in the boat. Had bullet hollowpoints on the old boat and they could be a little harsh to listen to in the cabin. The Revs are very smooth in and out of the boat. The true test for me is whether I can hear them when I'm behind the boat. The bullets were plenty loud to hear from 70', but I rarely got to hear them because my wife wouldn't turn 'em that loud because they'd rip her head off in the boat (illusion tower's less than optimal mounting positions also had something to do with that). With the revs, no prob, she'll let 'em rip. New boat has higher and farther back mounting position too, so that also probably has something to do with it.

I have this exact same setup and am very pleased with a single 600.2 on 2 pair of REV 10's.

If I wanted them to perform a little better, I would probably go for 2 300.2 amps, it would seem to be cheaper than another 600.2. But at this point we are blasting pretty dang well.

I have been doing my research on this over the last week, as I am about to fall into the same category. 2 pairs of Rev10s or, 1 pair Rev10s and 1Pair Pro80s. Putting that much speaker on your tower underpowered can be considered nothing less than communist.

The Fosgate T1000-4 seems to fit perfectly for 2 pair. It will put out a true tested 325 watts per speaker (650w per pair) at 14V x 4 when bridged a 2ohms x 2 channels. Check out the dynamic tested ratings:

The only other thing I will add is that it is class AD, vs AB, so it"ll suck less juice than a regular 2 channel amp comparitively, ie 80% efficient at 2 ohms bridged vs the 60-70% efficiency of an AB. Cost is around $610 shipped from sonicelectronix

Rated Power

(RMS Continuous Power) 250 Watts x 4 @ 4-Ohm

250 Watts x 4 @ 2-Ohm

250 Watts x 4 @ 1-Ohm

500 Watts x 2 @ 4-Ohm Bridged

500 Watts x 2 @ 2-Ohm Bridged

Total Power

(Sum of Rated Power) 1000 Watts RMS

Dynamic Power

(PVC/PowerCube® Measurement) 250 Watts x 4 @ 4-Ohm

325 Watts x 4 @ 2-Ohm

360 Watts x 4 @ 1-Ohm

610 Watts x 2 @ 4-Ohm Bridged

650 Watts x 2 @ 2-Ohm Bridged

The communist quote made me spit all over my screen. Good one.

I am not sure about AD vs. AB talk, but the Arc power supplies are very efficient and are labeled a Class H.

You could move your batteries to the walk thru like Liljohn did... I thought that was a awesome mod and now his passenger compartment has tons of room. (he fit two SRM27's and one SRM24 in the walk thru and mounted the prosport charger in there as well.

-Paul

I moved my batteries to underneath the passenger. That works very well and freed up far more storage than it takes up. The challenge is that Malibu seats are a little short, and many lead acid batteries are just a little too tall, especially once you have them in a box. My boat came with some Odyssey batteries that are an AGM (no box needed), and are short enough that they fit under there perfectly. Just another option, consider AGM batteries and either put them on their side or pick a shorter battery type and move it under the passenger seat. My on board charger fits in there nicely too.

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Wakesetter67

You could move your batteries to the walk thru like Liljohn did... I thought that was a awesome mod and now his passenger compartment has tons of room. (he fit two SRM27's and one SRM24 in the walk thru and mounted the prosport charger in there as well.

-Paul

Love to see that Mod I would assume he has it posted somewhere??

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shawndoggy

If I wanted them to perform a little better, I would probably go for 2 300.2 amps, it would seem to be cheaper than another 600.2. But at this point we are blasting pretty dang well.

You would need two 300.4's not two 300.2's. The 300.2's "only" give about 175w per channel @ 4 ohms. The 300.4 can be bridged to deliver 2x350w @ 4 ohms.

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Bake's Marine

I moved my batteries to underneath the passenger. That works very well and freed up far more storage than it takes up. The challenge is that Malibu seats are a little short, and many lead acid batteries are just a little too tall, especially once you have them in a box. My boat came with some Odyssey batteries that are an AGM (no box needed), and are short enough that they fit under there perfectly. Just another option, consider AGM batteries and either put them on their side or pick a shorter battery type and move it under the passenger seat. My on board charger fits in there nicely too.

I love how they are smaller and how you can mount them sideways too but our customers have had really bad luck with AGM (optima for the most part) batteries. I honestly think the biggest problem is that they do not take care of them right (they rely on their alternator to charge and take care of them) In other ways customers have complained about the raw egg sulfer smell when they crank their stereo. The way AGMs' are build it lets power out so fast it creates a lot of heat in turn cooks the battery. We switched him to two interstate SRM-29 batteries and he has been using them for 3 seasons now with out a problem.

In some cases I believe they can work but for a majority of boaters you can't beat a deep cycle lead acid

Love to see that Mod I would assume he has it posted somewhere??

I just did a quick search and could not find it, i dropped him a message and told him to give me a link or post up some pictures for you.

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Wakesetter67

I love how they are smaller and how you can mount them sideways too but our customers have had really bad luck with AGM (optima for the most part) batteries. I honestly think the biggest problem is that they do not take care of them right (they rely on their alternator to charge and take care of them) In other ways customers have complained about the raw egg sulfer smell when they crank their stereo. The way AGMs' are build it lets power out so fast it creates a lot of heat in turn cooks the battery. We switched him to two interstate SRM-29 batteries and he has been using them for 3 seasons now with out a problem.

In some cases I believe they can work but for a majority of boaters you can't beat a deep cycle lead acid

I just did a quick search and could not find it, i dropped him a message and told him to give me a link or post up some pictures for you.

Thank You Paul, Hey Off topic...How is Your Dog...You Can PM The Answer...LOL

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Bake's Marine

Thank You Paul, Hey Off topic...How is Your Dog...You Can PM The Answer...LOL

He is okay, i just posted a reply in the official Cooper thread a few minutes ago.

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Bobby Light

Right here guy

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TallRedRider

You would need two 300.4's not two 300.2's. The 300.2's "only" give about 175w per channel @ 4 ohms. The 300.4 can be bridged to deliver 2x350w @ 4 ohms.

You speak truth. I was thinking bridging the 300.2 to get 700 watts, but it looks like you cannot bridge it under 4 Ohms, so you could not run it in parallel. So maybe 1 amp to each speaker...now that gives me goosebumps!

Edited by TallRedRider

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TallRedRider

I love how they are smaller and how you can mount them sideways too but our customers have had really bad luck with AGM (optima for the most part) batteries. I honestly think the biggest problem is that they do not take care of them right (they rely on their alternator to charge and take care of them) In other ways customers have complained about the raw egg sulfer smell when they crank their stereo. The way AGMs' are build it lets power out so fast it creates a lot of heat in turn cooks the battery. We switched him to two interstate SRM-29 batteries and he has been using them for 3 seasons now with out a problem.

In some cases I believe they can work but for a majority of boaters you can't beat a deep cycle lead acid

It seems that Optima was the rage about 2006 and they were very dependable and all they were cracked up to be, then around 2008 or so, they had a serious slip in quality and had many failures reported in these threads. They have apparently corrected that, and newer failures seem to be non-existent again. But because of that, I bet they lost a big chunk of market share, at least in boats. I probably would not go with another Optima based on the failure threads Circa 2008-2010.

I have had Kinetik and these Odysseys that seem pretty decent so far, but I do keep them on a charger. It is also critical that the charger be set up for the right AGM. For example, even the AGM settings on a ProSport charger do not match up perfectly with what is recommended by Kinetik, but the Xantrex does. Just rambling here....have missed the stereo threads the last month :lol::crazy::rockon:

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Bobby Light

I've weaned myself from AGM batteries almost alltogether for a different reason, unless you absolutely have to have one because of space issues they are an absolute waste of money compared to a wet cell. This takes into account the performance of them as well including reserve capacity.

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