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Oberon

Is the Prophecy too Much Ski for a Novice?

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Oberon

I found a really good deal for a 2011 Connelly Prophecy with a front Enzo and rear toe plate. The problem is I only started skiing this year and am definitely not an expert and I won't be able test the ski before I buy because the boat is already put away.

I really enjoy skiing. My wife and I ski nearly every Saturday and Sunday morning in the summer and we want to buy a course this winter so we plan on skiing as much or more next year. Last year I skied mostly on a Connelly F1x which I really liked but that is the extent of modern skis I have used. I'm concerned that the Prophecy is too far above my skill level and I won't be able to progress. Are skis like motorcycles? I wouldn't suggest a novice motorcyclist buy a Hyabusa because he will end up in a ditch; am I setting myself to end up in a "ditch?"

On another note, does anyone have a suggestion for a portable slalom course? We have to put it up and take it down the same day because its a busy lake. Is the Insta-Slalom a good system?

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jkendallmsce

I found a really good deal for a 2011 Connelly Prophecy with a front Enzo and rear toe plate. The problem is I only started skiing this year and am definitely not an expert and I won't be able test the ski before I buy because the boat is already put away.

I really enjoy skiing. My wife and I ski nearly every Saturday and Sunday morning in the summer and we want to buy a course this winter so we plan on skiing as much or more next year. Last year I skied mostly on a Connelly F1x which I really liked but that is the extent of modern skis I have used. I'm concerned that the Prophecy is too far above my skill level and I won't be able to progress. Are skis like motorcycles? I wouldn't suggest a novice motorcyclist buy a Hyabusa because he will end up in a ditch; am I setting myself to end up in a "ditch?"

On another note, does anyone have a suggestion for a portable slalom course? We have to put it up and take it down the same day because its a busy lake. Is the Insta-Slalom a good system?

Depends on what you want to do. Cruise or do the course. The top end skis are meant to kept on edge, ie going thru the course...so cruising is not what they do best.

Look on ski-it-again for a ski course. and if manually inclined, making one is pretty easy and does not cost that much. the necessary dimensions are on the web.

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Skier007

I found a really good deal for a 2011 Connelly Prophecy with a front Enzo and rear toe plate. The problem is I only started skiing this year and am definitely not an expert and I won't be able test the ski before I buy because the boat is already put away.

I really enjoy skiing. My wife and I ski nearly every Saturday and Sunday morning in the summer and we want to buy a course this winter so we plan on skiing as much or more next year. Last year I skied mostly on a Connelly F1x which I really liked but that is the extent of modern skis I have used. I'm concerned that the Prophecy is too far above my skill level and I won't be able to progress. Are skis like motorcycles? I wouldn't suggest a novice motorcyclist buy a Hyabusa because he will end up in a ditch; am I setting myself to end up in a "ditch?"

On another note, does anyone have a suggestion for a portable slalom course? We have to put it up and take it down the same day because its a busy lake. Is the Insta-Slalom a good system?

What speed and line length are you skiing at now? That will be one factor if that ski is too much for you. What bindings are on the F1X, that Enzo binding is very un-forgiving. I ski on an F1, my buddy bought a Prophecy this yaer with double Enzo,s, feel, didnt come out and broke his front ankle. You might be better off with the F1x for another year, at lest until you feel like you have progressed enough to up-grade. Do you have a chance to ski with people that have skied for awhile, that will help also....good luck!

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Sixball

I can't help with this ski or binding but will give you my 2 cents. I would not be afraid of going to a hi end ski as long as it is a forgiving ski and you are willing to push it.

Most of the advanced ski perform better if ski hard than just ridding them. I also prefer double boot but this is very personal. The one thing most will agree with is you want to have both feet come out or stay in in a fall.

If you are going to get a upper end ski be sure it is the right size also don't rush in just to get a ski.

In your position you can pick up a year old upper end ski or used ski for a steel most any time. Some new or blemish.

Upper end ski's can be tuned and ski very good but tuned wrong will ski like $#it.

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Oberon

Thanks for the feedback. The F1x has double draft bindings. I took a pretty nasty fall once last year and the ski didn't release. I went in head first and the ski went over the top of my body. It torqued my back and I didn't ski for a few weeks after that so I'm familiar with unforgiving bindings. That was a case of my imagination exceeding my talent...needless to say I backed off a bit after that.

Right now I ski at 15 off @ 35. I'm pretty comfortable but need to get more consistency and rhythm in my cuts. Cruising around the lake is boring to me. We have to get up pretty early to find good water on our lake so why waste it cruising?

I guess I could buy the ski and use it as I progress. The F1x belongs to our neighbor who skis with us early every weekend. He is a really good skier who skis at 41 mph!!! My crash gift bad enough at 35!

I don't realize you could build a ski course. That might be a good option. I'll have to do some research on that.

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Oberon

I can't help with this ski or binding but will give you my 2 cents. I would not be afraid of going to a hi end ski as long as it is a forgiving ski and you are willing to push it.

Most of the advanced ski perform better if ski hard than just ridding them. I also prefer double boot but this is very personal. The one thing most will agree with is you want to have both feet come out or stay in in a fall.

If you are going to get a upper end ski be sure it is the right size also don't rush in just to get a ski.

In your position you can pick up a year old upper end ski or used ski for a steel most any time. Some new or blemish.

Upper end ski's can be tuned and ski very good but tuned wrong will ski like $#it.

The ski is 68" an I'm about 200 lbs so I think its the right size. I hadn't thought about single vs. double bindings. I can see how a single binding that doesn't release could be trouble. I like double bindings so maybe the thing to do is upgrade the rtp to a binding.

It's probably clear that I'm leaning toward buying the ski. I sold my Jet Ski last year for the purpose of buying a ski so it will happen eventually one way or another. I just want to make sure I'm not going to put myself in a position to miss work after skiing.

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jjackkrash

Slalom skiing is the best sport in the whole wide world, welcome aboard!

68" and 200 lbs. is right on the money.

On bindings, there isn't a right or safest set up, I have seen or heard of serious injuries using just about every set up imaginable. Skiing is risky, period. I prefer double boots, but pros ski both single and double boot set ups, so its just preference. Avoiding injury is more about skiing in control and making sure the equipment is not worn or broken and properly adjusted. You have to be a gear head and monitor your equipment if you want to be safe.

I ski on a Connelly F1, my next ski will likely be a Prophesy, but I hate the Draft bindings. Look into Radar RS-1/Strata bindings. I think they are the best thing since sliced bread.

You don't need a high-end ski to learn the course, but I don't think it will hurt you any, as long as you are willing to learn about fin adjustment. If you have a high-end ski with an adjustable fin, you need a set of calipers to measure the fin setting. Even if you run stock settings, you have to learn how to measure and adjust your fin in case the fin moves, and it will occasionally. I etch my fin with a mark along the base and I can usually visually tell if it has moved, but I still check mine with calipers regularly because even small--micro--adjustments will effect the way it skis. There is no getting around learning about fin adjustment if you get a high-end ski.

41 mph is too fast. No ski is made to ski that fast, the pros ski at 36, us old guys ski at 34. When you get in the course, be ready to get humbled, and be ready to ski at 28-30 mph while you learn. The balls come up fast, even at slower speeds.

Check out ballofspray.com. Its all skiing, all the time.

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jkendallmsce

Thanks for the feedback. The F1x has double draft bindings. I took a pretty nasty fall once last year and the ski didn't release. I went in head first and the ski went over the top of my body. It torqued my back and I didn't ski for a few weeks after that so I'm familiar with unforgiving bindings. That was a case of my imagination exceeding my talent...needless to say I backed off a bit after that.

Right now I ski at 15 off @ 35. I'm pretty comfortable but need to get more consistency and rhythm in my cuts. Cruising around the lake is boring to me. We have to get up pretty early to find good water on our lake so why waste it cruising?

I guess I could buy the ski and use it as I progress. The F1x belongs to our neighbor who skis with us early every weekend. He is a really good skier who skis at 41 mph!!! My crash gift bad enough at 35!

I don't realize you could build a ski course. That might be a good option. I'll have to do some research on that.

And the 41 mph is waaay tooo fast. and others are right about the 34 and 36 mph depending on your age. Going faster will do notthing for you. outside of getting you hurt.

I would suggest when starting out, to get a few lessons. It is much easier to learn the correct technique, than to undo bad habits....and less painfull...also the local shop may have a few different ski to try out. So you can find the ski that works best for you.

toughest sport I have done. But most exhilerating, specially when shortening the rope.

Good luck and there are quite a few on this site that ski short line that will help!!

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Sixball

:plus1: on 41 MPH is to fast. Slalom skis are made for 36 MPH and less.

200lbs 68" may be ok 67 is fine also if you are fit. Ability and speed has a lot to do with size. I have moved to a 68" 2 or 3 years ago but skied a 67 and I am over 200 for many years. I am getting to old for the smaller ski now. :lol:

Wiley's have a nice Hi wrap that perform very well and release well. I also like the Radar RS-1/Strata bindings. They get a lot of very good feed back.

One of our crew went to them this year after a bad broken leg laet last year. He believes the release is very good.

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jkendallmsce

:plus1: on 41 MPH is to fast. Slalom skis are made for 36 MPH and less.

200lbs 68" may be ok 67 is fine also if you are fit. Ability and speed has a lot to do with size. I have moved to a 68" 2 or 3 years ago but skied a 67 and I am over 200 for many years. I am getting to old for the smaller ski now. :lol:

Wiley's have a nice Hi wrap that perform very well and release well. I also like the Radar RS-1/Strata bindings. They get a lot of very good feed back.

One of our crew went to them this year after a bad broken leg laet last year. He believes the release is very good.

Yep!! release is always good. having both legs/knees working for monday am is always good. have buds who like the frogman/hard shell...but that is a personal preference. Wileys is very good to work with. Darrin is very helpful and knowledgeable. and they have a great slection and pricing is very good. Look at adreline sports in WA, too. I have been on a Monza for a couple of years, and like it. It will carry a skier into 41 off....not that I am there...yet. I went with the 70 inch, and with the new tchnolgy, etc it works well for me.

Technolgy is always getting better. When you look at what the old timers were skiing on, I have always wondered how well laPoint could do with the new top end skis and being 30 years younger.

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jjackkrash

Technolgy is always getting better. When you look at what the old timers were skiing on, I have always wondered how well laPoint could do with the new top end skis and being 30 years younger.

Bob La Point was the first person to run 38' off in an R tournament. He did it in 1980. That same year, he won the World Slalom Title on a wooden ski.

http://www.mahaskis.com/history.html

Skis today are so much better it isn't even close. You don't even have to slow the ski down now to get it to turn, and you can adjust the fin, flex patterns, bindings placement, use hardshells, whatever, to make the ski fit you, not the other way around. Nobody blinks an eye about running 38' off now a days, but put some of the top pros on a wood maha with rubber, loose fitting bindings and see how far they get. Make no mistake, the old timers could ski.

Edited by jjackkrash

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jkendallmsce

Bob La Point was the first person to run 38' off in an R tournament. He did it in 1980. That same year, he won the World Slalom Title on a wooden ski.

http://www.mahaskis.com/history.html

Skis today are so much better it isn't even close. You don't even have to slow the ski down now to get it to turn, and you can adjust the fin, flex patterns, bindings placement, use hardshells, whatever, to make the ski fit you, not the other way around. Nobody blinks an eye about running 38' off now a days, but put some of the top pros on a wood maha with rubber, loose fitting bindings and see how far they get. Make no mistake, the old timers could ski.

Having skied with Bob and watched him at the Brentwood pro-am, you are 100% right.

I have an old Connely hook and a maja, and AINT NO WAY...but Bob could and did.

The man can ski!!!

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WoodyBC

Listen to these guys about bindings that release. I'm just starting to walk again after breaking my front ankle from by connlley fastrack front binding that I have. I should of had two that held me tight, but only had the one on the front, rear was a toe kick. Rear came out, front twisted all to heck causing a bilateral fracture. I'm going to invest in two boots that release, although I love the feel of the control you have with the locking boot. Cant afford to be off work again.

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jkendallmsce

Listen to these guys about bindings that release. I'm just starting to walk again after breaking my front ankle from by connlley fastrack front binding that I have. I should of had two that held me tight, but only had the one on the front, rear was a toe kick. Rear came out, front twisted all to heck causing a bilateral fracture. I'm going to invest in two boots that release, although I love the feel of the control you have with the locking boot. Cant afford to be off work again.

Bummer...I hope you heal up and are back to skiing next spring.

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davemac

As others have advised or implied, I think there are better and safer choices in bindings out there. It may be coincidence, but the three people I know of who have had bad foot/ankle injuries were all on the same bindings.

On a more positive note, Connelly had a reputation for great customer service. They also have a whole new binding/release design being introduced. The Prophecy seems to be a ski that works great for some, and not so great for others. It may work great for you...but ideally you should find some way of trying it first. Good Luck.

Regarding your slalom course question, Ed Obermeier is active on this board, and owns EZSlalom. His product is well thought of and his reputation and expertise are solid. He will not use this board to self promote (so I just did it for him). I would start with him... I'm sure you'll be satisfied.

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Molarbu

I was amazed at how squirly that prophecy is. You may want to hold off for a while.

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Oberon

I'll probably hold off on buying the ski until spring so I can ride it before buying. It's been sitting in the shop all summer so I doubt it will sell over the winter.

The ski is priced so that I could add a rear binding and still feel comfortable with what I spent.

I really appreciate the feedback. I really enjoy skiing but I'm no expert and don't even know the right questions to ask sometimes.

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ed obermeier

Thanks for the plug Dave (check is in the mail...).

I have worked over the years with a lot of beginner course skiers of various starting ability. To a person, everyone I started with who was on a higher end ski struggled until they finally got on a ski that was more suited to their current ability level. Your motorcycle analogy was spot on - too much machine in a beginners hands, somebodys gonna get hurt. Actually IMO a high performance ski is more likely to hold you back then help you. You want the ski to have some headroom to grow into, but it has to work for the level you're at now too so you have a solid starting point to work forward from. Make sense?

Dependent on your current ability, most beginner skiers who are used to free skiing "fast" find out real quickly that to run the course you gotta take a few steps back, slow down, and learn some technique. The suggestion above to get some coaching from a good veteran course skier was excellent advice and I'd advise the same. Generally the beginners I've worked with started running the course at 28 to 32 mph, 30 being a good average starting point. At that level a performance wide ride (your F1X being in that catagory) IMO is the right ski for that. Get some coaching on the basics, work on that at a slower speed so you have time to think through it, as your performance improves upgrade to a more appropriate ski for your ability. Once you've dialed in the basic skills a high end ski can help you get better faster. But, IMO you want to start the journey on a more forgiving ski at lower speeds to reduce the learning curve as much as possible.

As stated above, there are plenty of 1 - 3 year old skis available on the market (Ski-it-again is a great resource) that can be had for half or less of what they sold for new and they're still going to be excellent skis. A good deal now on a ski you can't make do what you wanna do ain't really such a good deal.

There are plenty of fairly priced used skis out there, you'll find an acceptable deal on one no problem. My $0.02 FWIW

Ed

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Oberon

Thank you very much for the advice. I have a lot of ideas based on this thread and additional research. I love this forum!

1) I'll hurt myself on the Prophecy. User Brian M suggested that I look at the Connelly V which, apparently, is the successor to the F1x. Since I like the F1x I'll definitely look at the V. The F1x doesn't actually belong to me which is why I'm looking for a different ski.

2) I should take lessons. Since neither my wife nor I have ever gone though a course this seems like it might be a good idea. This might be a good excuse to go to Florida sometime this winter. Winter skiing in Michigan is done with different equipment. Any suggestions are appreciated.

3) I really want a course. It sounds like a good project but I'm guessing it will end up costing as much or more than buying a used course (sorry Ed). I can't find plans on the internet so it would take a lot of trial and error. I'm guessing taking up such a project will end up with a garage full of PVC and a store bought course. The jury is still out.

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ed obermeier

A used course can be a good investment; beware lower priced ones for sale that you have to ship anywhere. Shiping can get pretty costly and how it's packaged (and what condition it arrives in) can be an issue. Try to find one fairly locally if possible so you can pick it up and save the shippingcosts and issues. Check Ski-It-Again, some on there right now.

If you have any questions on the subject or if I can be helpful in any manner please feel free to drop me a line, no obligation whatsoever. I'll be happy to be helpful in whatever manner I'm able.

Best Regards, Ed

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