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Homebrew MTC


scott_fx

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I posted this over at mp3car and thought you guys may be interested in my new undertaking. i figured you guys have experience with malibu's mtc and could probably give me some feedback on my own design.

I'm about to drop my boat off for a full reupholstering, my stereo was being a bit finiky last year and I got the itch again...

Immediate system design goal:

seamless control of non-vital functions

integrated media

--mp3, video, xm, ipod control

ballast control

-- 6 pumps 3 ballast bags (future plans to add one more bag and two more pumps).

-- each ballast will be controlled independently by touching the corresponding spot on the boat icon

-- option to fill all, empty all, and to stop all pumps via independent master controls

non critical systems

-- amp turn on

-- lighting

-- engine bay vent/blower on a timer

future additions:

rear view cam/dvr

-- helps the driver keep an eye forward while monitoring the wakeboarder

--dvr will be useful to critique runs

integrated gps based speed control (perfect pass) to be adjust via ballast 'fill state' presets

-- would like 3 skill level presets. one button would fill the ballast and adjust the speed accordingly

code based engine start

--punch in the code and crank the engine. (with hidden key override)

System specs:

mobo - ASRock A330ION

hd - 60 gb solid state drive

ram - 1 gb (faster boot times with less ram) gotta love ram prices... $13 for 1 gb of ram. :D

os - win7

front end - centrafuse (http://www.centrafuse.com/CentrafuseAuto.aspx?pid=93)

i/o integration hardware - leaning towards fusion brain. but usb-io-1 is still in the running (http://store.mp3car.com/Fusion_Brain_Version_6_p/com-133.htm)

i/o integration plugin - modified Sonicxtacy02 plugin (see skin design below)

rearview cam - see below

soundcard -- undecided (not terribly important since sq isn't exactly something that is achievable in a boat (clean/loud... yes... sq... no)

Install info.

-- install transreflective 7" xenarc in the insturment cluster. sealing the touchpanel to the newly designed abs facade to protect the xenarc lcd.

-- aux sony RMX11M control of the pc. installed in the glove box lid or the rear seatback (http://www.amazon.com/Sony-RMX11M-2-5-Inch-Splash-Proof-Control/dp/B0015FTZQO/ref=dp_cp_ob_e_image_2)

-- adding led accent/interior lights to the cabin

that's the plan. im sure it'll grow as time goes on. but i'm going to try to keep my sights focused this time around.

now on to the pics. at the expense of saving all of you from having to see me with my shirt off. here is the boat before the reupholstering:

9f6.jpg

the current state of the interior:

208.jpg

the new color scheme reference:

537.jpg

my current skin design for the centrafusion plugin (or usb-io-1)

more pics here:

http://scott_fx.onfinite.com/album/1658284/1658296/

BALLAST CONTROL

UPDATED WITH NEW PICS. SEE PAGE 2 FOR V02 AND V03 DESIGN CHANGES

as for the rearview cam i wanted something that was waterproof and 1080p but it needed to be a webcam. I found a few really nice helmet cams but they didnt meet both requirements of being 1080p and webcam capable.

there are a few home webcams that seem to be 1080p but aren't waterproof. I think i can build a bullet enclosure out of a piece of 3" abs pipe and chemically weld a plate on the back and a 72mm abs lens adaptor to the 'front'. Adding a polorizing filter should make it pretty water resistant.

components starting to come in:

dde.jpg

Edited by scott_fx
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I will be back to check in on this one! Looks like you one heck of a project, cant wait to see the finished product! Has anyone put in an after market screen in a Bu before?

Edited by BlitzedVLX
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thanks for the interest. I'd love to know if any of you have issues with the malibu mtc or things that you think could have been done differently.

i just ordered the first components for the project. though i have to wait for the controller since the newest version isn't for sale yet. This weekend i'll take some measurements of the dash and order the abs.

good thing about it, i think it'll be pretty easy to replicate if i get it up and running. The one thing that may not happen is the perfect pass integration. Im talking with one of the tech's over there right now to see if there is an easy way to do it. I'm not a programmer so that will limit me greatly on that end. (though the fusion brain has the ability to hijack the signal from the perfect pass controller... so it could be accomplished by someone skilled in that area)

skicrave.... this version has grown from what we had originally talked about. i'm excited about it and any input... be it good or bad is always welcome (from anyone). You've been a great deal of help already

Edited by scott_fx
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Isn't there an automation controls guy on this board?

I think it's MartinArcher. I'm sure he'll be here to chime in and give his :rockon: or :thumbup:

Edited by Pistol Pete
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That's a pretty awesome idea. I'm curious how you are going to interface w/ the malibu components tho. Do you have schematics for the malibu brain? Or are you just going to wire along side everything?

TI has a good selection of micro controllers (MSP430) that have lots of wireless options available. They also have a 'waterproof watch' (Chronos) that can interface with the MSP430s. I've considering building a engine compartment temp monitor (for winter) using some of those components, but haven't had enough time/impetus to get off my keister and do it.

I'm not much of a windows programmer, but I might be able to offer some assistance w/ the mirco controller. I'm assuming you'd really only be using that for status type stuff tho, and wiring up LEDs is pretty trivial.

I'm just as anxious as you to see how this turns out!

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Im not going to interface with a lot of the stock gauges. I want to keep anything that is critical relatively untouched. My dash had two speedometers and a tach, fortunately the perfect pass has a speedo and tach on the multiline display. so i can replace 3 gauges with one. on the other side of the screen I'll have room for the engine temp, oil temp and fuel as well as one other. haven't decided if i want voltage or depth gauge. I think I'll probably end up retaining the depth gauge and either have the voltage displayed by the computer or mold in a digital voltage meter into the dash piece.

I can also have centrafuse display speed via a gps dongle if i see fit. The great thing about centrafuse is the community and the ability to download custom skins for the program. I may try to modify a skin and have the speed displayed on the menu screens.

If anyone is interested in dropping the gauges completely, the fusion brain is designed to read in analog and digital inputs. for those a little more tech savy then i, you could easily read and display any data that the malibu computer is spitting out. here are the specs: http://www.mp3car.com/fusion-brain/144750-new-fusion-brain-version-6-pre-order-now.html

I just checked out the MSP430... very interesting. will have to do some more reading on that. Also, thank you for your offer to help. If i stumble on any step of the process i may take you up on the offer. it's very much appreciated.

I got my 1gb ram last night and i am currently installing the os and centrafuse to start my tweaking. unfortunately the fusion brain v6 isn't shipping yet. so i'll have to wait to really crack into the most challenging part of the build. One thing i have to mention is the awesome speed of a solid state hard drive. booting into windows is amazingly fast!

By trade, i am a cg modeler. I took my skillset and spent my friday night modeling a gyro stabilized tower camera mount. :) It should be easily replicated using common materials that you can find at a hardware store and an rc/hobby shop. This will probably be the last thing i tackle (may not even make it for the start of the season) but If anyone wants to collaborate ideas we can start a new thread for that project.

That's a pretty awesome idea. I'm curious how you are going to interface w/ the malibu components tho. Do you have schematics for the malibu brain? Or are you just going to wire along side everything?

TI has a good selection of micro controllers (MSP430) that have lots of wireless options available. They also have a 'waterproof watch' (Chronos) that can interface with the MSP430s. I've considering building a engine compartment temp monitor (for winter) using some of those components, but haven't had enough time/impetus to get off my keister and do it.

I'm not much of a windows programmer, but I might be able to offer some assistance w/ the mirco controller. I'm assuming you'd really only be using that for status type stuff tho, and wiring up LEDs is pretty trivial.

I'm just as anxious as you to see how this turns out!

Edited by scott_fx
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Yep, Pete's right. I'm a control and automation engineer. I'm jet lagged out of my mind today as I just got back from Australia and saw this thread. Very cool project. I give it a Rockon.gif and a Thumbup.gif.

I built a GPS speedo for my old school Bu. You can find that project here.

I think your project will be a blast and a lot of fun. Check this link out for ideas on making a waterproof camera assembly.

I've always thought about making my won Car PC for my old Bu. It would be a neat way to update it. The DVR wake cam has always been on my wish list along with a PP system.

I used an Arduino for my Speedo and thought I would eventually integrate fly by wire throttle and my own PP control. I finished a lot of the closed loop throttle software, but never order linear actuators or pots for the throttle. Might have to re-kindle that project this spring after I get the 4" exhaust and Stainless Marine manifolds installed.

One thing with boats - you never run out of things to mess with. LOL.gif

Good luck and keep us posted on your project! Thumbup.gif

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Im so envious of you. I'd love to have the time and energy to learn how to code. I have so many arduino ideas!!

That project came out perfect too. that's the same level of quality i'm trying to achieve. something that looks like it could have come from the factory. I installd a car pc in my last car it i was so pleased with the fit and finish that i'm pretty comfortable with tackling the fabrication aspect of this project.

let me know if you're interested in the dvr webcam and we can toss around some ideas. I'm building mine out of a pcb cam and 3 servos with a gyro stabalize and tracking system. could use your coding experience with the tracking aspect. would like to use a gyro attached to the line but have the servo compensate so the framing is correct and to not spaz out when the rider falls. (some sort of buffer)

Yep, Pete's right. I'm a control and automation engineer. I'm jet lagged out of my mind today as I just got back from Australia and saw this thread. Very cool project. I give it a Rockon.gif and a Thumbup.gif.

I built a GPS speedo for my old school Bu. You can find that project here.

I think your project will be a blast and a lot of fun. Check this link out for ideas on making a waterproof camera assembly.

I've always thought about making my won Car PC for my old Bu. It would be a neat way to update it. The DVR wake cam has always been on my wish list along with a PP system.

I used an Arduino for my Speedo and thought I would eventually integrate fly by wire throttle and my own PP control. I finished a lot of the closed loop throttle software, but never order linear actuators or pots for the throttle. Might have to re-kindle that project this spring after I get the 4" exhaust and Stainless Marine manifolds installed.

One thing with boats - you never run out of things to mess with. LOL.gif

Good luck and keep us posted on your project! Thumbup.gif

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Im so envious of you. I'd love to have the time and energy to learn how to code. I have so many arduino ideas!!

That project came out perfect too. that's the same level of quality i'm trying to achieve. something that looks like it could have come from the factory. I installd a car pc in my last car it i was so pleased with the fit and finish that i'm pretty comfortable with tackling the fabrication aspect of this project.

let me know if you're interested in the dvr webcam and we can toss around some ideas. I'm building mine out of a pcb cam and 3 servos with a gyro stabalize and tracking system. could use your coding experience with the tracking aspect. would like to use a gyro attached to the line but have the servo compensate so the framing is correct and to not spaz out when the rider falls. (some sort of buffer)

Nothing to envy. LOL.gif The Arduino stuff is really fun and a great place to start learning software. The website is choked full of awesome ideas and example code to get you compiling and cooking up all kinds of awesome projects in no time. Rockon.gif

Yeah, the gyro input to a motion control system would rock. Not sure if you would need three servo's though. I can see one for sure and possibly two if you want to keep the rider centered during a big air jump. I'd love to play with it. I'd like to hear your ideas on it. You are right about the rope slap. What you would need is a low pass filter in the software to knock of the "noise" caused by rapid changes to the gyro position caused by rope slap. It could certainly be done and with the Arduino you could even add a knob (pot) that could control the filter's gain to tune how responsive you want the camera to be to the gyro's input.

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Nothing to envy. LOL.gif The Arduino stuff is really fun and a great place to start learning software. The website is choked full of awesome ideas and example code to get you compiling and cooking up all kinds of awesome projects in no time. Rockon.gif

Yeah, the gyro input to a motion control system would rock. Not sure if you would need three servo's though. I can see one for sure and possibly two if you want to keep the rider centered during a big air jump. I'd love to play with it. I'd like to hear your ideas on it. You are right about the rope slap. What you would need is a low pass filter in the software to knock of the "noise" caused by rapid changes to the gyro position caused by rope slap. It could certainly be done and with the Arduino you could even add a knob (pot) that could control the filter's gain to tune how responsive you want the camera to be to the gyro's input.

bare with me on this. in the programs i model in we deal in x,y,z, with x running left to right, y goes up and down and z running front to back. (i believe cad is slightly different...but i'm going to stick with that.)

--first axis mounted to the cam would be a servo to control roll on the z axis. this will keep the horizon horizontal when you turn and hit someones wake. the gyro would be mounted to the camera and hooked directly to the servo

--second axis would be aligned with the camera lens and the z rot servo. this will keep the camera flat so when you start off and bow up, you wont be looking straight into the water. this gyro also could be hooked up directly to the servo and mounted on the camera as well.

--third axis would control the panning (y-rot). this technically doesn't need to be aligned with the camera lens since we'll be using a long-ish lens and it wont be dealing with 'correcting' the boats movement. this would be affixed to the tower, this is the tricky gryo. the cleanest solution is to just attach this gyro to the rope. this will always have the camera pointing in the direction of the rider. (as long as the camera lens is located under the rope attachment point). this would need the post processing done to the feed between the gyro and the servo. I believe that this way would always keep the rider in the center of the screen since we aren't dealing with any slack. there probably could be some compensation added to this if you want to 'correctly' frame a shot so the rider is in the 1/3 sweet spot of the frame. but that's just gravy. also there could be a function that would look for this rider down behavior of the rope and trigger a remote led to let the driver know someone has fallen

i was thinking of a sd solution based on the limits of my pc. (one could easily scale this to handle a gopro hd cam if they wanted a stand alone hd solution)

using a pcb mount camera like this:

http://www.camera2000.com/en/600tvl-color-board-camera-3-6mm-cs-lens-osd-d-wdr-sony-super-had-ccd.html

with an optional 16mm lens (talked to them and they would substitute it for the same price. It's not exactly hd (720i even). but i think it'll give a decent quality image and will definitely be good enough as a monitor camera.

we could run inexpensive mini servos also saving on weight (and cost) to get a very smooth (i hope) shot. we may need to add a mechanical damper or two if there is any high frequency jitter with the servos (i was thinking rc shock would do fine)

Edited by scott_fx
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bare with me on this. in the programs i model in we deal in x,y,z, with x running left to right, y goes up and down and z running front to back. (i believe cad is slightly different...but i'm going to stick with that.)

--first axis mounted to the cam would be a servo to control roll on the z axis. this will keep the horizon horizontal when you turn and hit someones wake. the gyro would be mounted to the camera and hooked directly to the servo

--second axis would be aligned with the camera lens and the z rot servo. this will keep the camera flat so when you start off and bow up, you wont be looking straight into the water. this gyro also could be hooked up directly to the servo and mounted on the camera as well.

--third axis would control the panning (y-rot). this technically doesn't need to be aligned with the camera lens since we'll be using a long-ish lens and it wont be dealing with 'correcting' the boats movement. this would be affixed to the tower, this is the tricky gryo. the cleanest solution is to just attach this gyro to the rope. this will always have the camera pointing in the direction of the rider. (as long as the camera lens is located under the rope attachment point). this would need the post processing done to the feed between the gyro and the servo. I believe that this way would always keep the rider in the center of the screen since we aren't dealing with any slack. there probably could be some compensation added to this if you want to 'correctly' frame a shot so the rider is in the 1/3 sweet spot of the frame. but that's just gravy. also there could be a function that would look for this rider down behavior of the rope and trigger a remote led to let the driver know someone has fallen

i was thinking of a sd solution based on the limits of my pc. (one could easily scale this to handle a gopro hd cam if they wanted a stand alone hd solution)

using a pcb mount camera like this:

http://www.camera200...er-had-ccd.html

with an optional 16mm lens (talked to them and they would substitute it for the same price. It's not exactly hd (720i even). but i think it'll give a decent quality image and will definitely be good enough as a monitor camera.

we could run inexpensive mini servos also saving on weight (and cost) to get a very smooth (i hope) shot. we may need to add a mechanical damper or two if there is any high frequency jitter with the servos (i was thinking rc shock would do fine)

Right on. The z axis camera is the one I am thinking wouldn't be needed. When under way, the boat doesn't experience much "roll" when crossing wakes. When off plane it's a bit of a different story, but I don't think it would be near enough to justify another servo and would certainly greatly complicate the software.

The left/right pan servo (I would call X-axis) is by far the most important and would be the most active servo as the rider cuts in and out of the wake and would need the most filtering from the gyro.

Depending on the amount of bow rise the y axis up/down servo wouldn't need too much movement. If you filmed with the camera zoomed out enough you wouldn't need it, but I certainly see a benefit of having it. I know most "wake cameras" out there currently just rotate on the x-axis and the y-axis is set up for the rider under way.

Not sure if you've seen them, but here is the website for the "tracker", it is probably the most popular wake cam out there.....

http://wakevideo.com/

Cool camera - could surely come up with a little enclosure for that. Did you have a gyro in mind?

On the servo's, I have a bit of experience there too. I model airplanes and have everything from the little micro servo foamy electrics, to a giant scale Ultimate Bi-plane with a 100cc 10hp Desert Aircraft engine. That plane has some very impressive Hitec digital servos.

I think to support the weight of a camera housing and the "slap" it could experience from wake crossings it would need to have a pretty robust set of servos. The digital servo precision wouldn't be needed, as the analogs are still very smooth and return to a precise position wouldn't be as critical as smoothly following the gyro's input.

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i was planning on using the rc plain gyros. i believe the heading lock gyros would do the job. no programing needed. and as far as the servo. i think that it depends on the design. i think we could get away with the miniature ones as long as they weren't carrying the load. i think the pan servo should be a regular sized servo (was thinking the Power HD DS090M based on price and this review:

)

the pcb camera is 38mmx38mm im guessing that the mini servo can roll that one pretty easily. and depending on the pitch mechanism. that would be a toss up. If we did it on all 3 axis then we could use a longer lens camera which would be really nice. (can't go too long because it would amplify vibrations)

as for the gyro's. there are a couple i was looking at. but i was leaning toward this futaba clone. think its cnc401 or something like that. there are a slew of sub $15 gyro's on the market. not sure how smooth they would be. but something to look into (with some dampening) (http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=10113)

this is another interesting find, tailer made for areal photography:

http://www.rotorpics.com/

another option to conisder is using a mechanical gyro on one of the axis's. im just not sure about drift. but i'd assume that mechanical gyro's have better precision then servo based systems..

i.e.

http://www.maxx300.com/

after thinking about your post for a night. you may be right to delete the 'roll' servo. could introduce some noise.

Right on. The z axis camera is the one I am thinking wouldn't be needed. When under way, the boat doesn't experience much "roll" when crossing wakes. When off plane it's a bit of a different story, but I don't think it would be near enough to justify another servo and would certainly greatly complicate the software.

The left/right pan servo (I would call X-axis) is by far the most important and would be the most active servo as the rider cuts in and out of the wake and would need the most filtering from the gyro.

Depending on the amount of bow rise the y axis up/down servo wouldn't need too much movement. If you filmed with the camera zoomed out enough you wouldn't need it, but I certainly see a benefit of having it. I know most "wake cameras" out there currently just rotate on the x-axis and the y-axis is set up for the rider under way.

Not sure if you've seen them, but here is the website for the "tracker", it is probably the most popular wake cam out there.....

http://wakevideo.com/

Cool camera - could surely come up with a little enclosure for that. Did you have a gyro in mind?

On the servo's, I have a bit of experience there too. I model airplanes and have everything from the little micro servo foamy electrics, to a giant scale Ultimate Bi-plane with a 100cc 10hp Desert Aircraft engine. That plane has some very impressive Hitec digital servos.

I think to support the weight of a camera housing and the "slap" it could experience from wake crossings it would need to have a pretty robust set of servos. The digital servo precision wouldn't be needed, as the analogs are still very smooth and return to a precise position wouldn't be as critical as smoothly following the gyro's input.

Edited by scott_fx
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That's a cool looking servo and this would be a great application for a test. I won't fly a new brand of servo in a plane until testing it first. Might be the next servo for my profile. Biggrin.gif

That gyro might not be too bad. I have the exact same one on my T-rex heli, but it does not hold a candle to the genuine Futaba, but for about 10% of the price it holds the boom plenty still for my heli skills. I'm a 3D plane pilot trying to learn helis one crash at a time. LOL.gif

The dampener will be a must. Some sort of fluid dampening plate or the shock idea would be cool, but I'm no ME. Whistling.gif

The only thing that worries me about the gyro used for the rope tracking with a controller is precision. I think with a reasonably priced controller, the lack of high bit count floating point precision will eventually drift mean the angle tracking will slowly loose it's aim on the rope as the voltage tracking drifts over time. The only way to find out how much is to give it a go. I think the best thing to do would be start with a single axis (rope swing on the x axis) and go from there. If it works well, add the y axis and rock out. Rockon.gif

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very valid suggestions. you're onto something. :)

im staying late at work now. redesigning the skins for the mtc. i'll try to post some tonight. :)

That's a cool looking servo and this would be a great application for a test. I won't fly a new brand of servo in a plane until testing it first. Might be the next servo for my profile. Biggrin.gif

That gyro might not be too bad. I have the exact same one on my T-rex heli, but it does not hold a candle to the genuine Futaba, but for about 10% of the price it holds the boom plenty still for my heli skills. I'm a 3D plane pilot trying to learn helis one crash at a time. LOL.gif

The dampener will be a must. Some sort of fluid dampening plate or the shock idea would be cool, but I'm no ME. Whistling.gif

The only thing that worries me about the gyro used for the rope tracking with a controller is precision. I think with a reasonably priced controller, the lack of high bit count floating point precision will eventually drift mean the angle tracking will slowly loose it's aim on the rope as the voltage tracking drifts over time. The only way to find out how much is to give it a go. I think the best thing to do would be start with a single axis (rope swing on the x axis) and go from there. If it works well, add the y axis and rock out. Rockon.gif

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here is v.02 of the skin. i ripped it off almost entirely from the new lexus sports car

input is welcome

279.jpg

38a.jpg

70b.jpg

ebe.jpg

3e5.jpg

still working on this but here is a sample if i decide to add gauge readings to the system

600.jpg

Edited by scott_fx
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Pretty cool looks Scott. Quite the project, like to hear how it progresses. Just try and keep it simple for us non-engineer types!

thank you

i'd love to keep it pretty open source so that anyone interested could collaborate on this. I'm not engineer or programmer (I model 3d for movies to pay the bills) so i think everything should be pretty easily replicated.

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