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cyoda44

Help with Cruise speed variations

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cyoda44

Has anyone had a problem with the cruise speed varing alot.

Situation was.... I picked up my new VTX last Saturday. It has a LCR 320 and an acme 537 prop. My wife was wakeboarding at 18mph and the cruise was all over the place. Varing from 20 to 17 mph. As I was driving you could hear the engine rev's going up and down drastically. When she finished her shortened run "could not take the constant change in speed" she ask if I had not turned on the cruise. "she sometimes forgets to turn on the cruise for me"

The boat was loaded fairly well with 9 adults.

I ask my dealer if there was an adjustment for the cruise and was told there was not one.

My question is.... How can I fix this problem?

Edited by cyoda44

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CedarLakeSkier
Has anyone had a problem with the cruise speed varing alot.

Situation was.... I picked up my new VTX last Saturday. It has a LCR 320 and an acme 537 prop. My wife was wakeboarding at 18mph and the cruise was all over the place. Varing from 20 to 17 mph. As I was driving you could hear the engine rev's going up and down drastically. When she finished her shortened run "could not take the constant change in speed" she ask if I had not turned on the cruise. "she sometimes forgets to turn on the cruise for me"

The boat was loaded fairly well with 9 adults.

I ask my dealer if there was an adjustment for the cruise and was told there was not one.

My question is.... How can I fix this problem?

You could check the paddlewheel to make sure it's not broken or stuck. Did it change speeds around corners? because that can affect the paddlewheel.

17 to 20 isn't that much of a speed change if it's done gradually, but I admit reving from 17 to 20 quickly and then dropping would get irritating.

Can you switch to RPM mode? That may give you more of a steady pull.

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99response

Any speed control is going to battle holding speed with a loaded down boat that well, usually a little help from the driver to keep in in range helps.

-Chris

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Sandbagger

When the speed control engages you still have to bump the throttle so the little box is in the middle of the sweet spot on the gage, maybe you need to bump it another notch or two.

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CedarLakeSkier
Any speed control is going to battle holding speed with a loaded down boat that well, usually a little help from the driver to keep in in range helps.

-Chris

How would you do that? With my cruise control on it doesn't respond to my throttle unless I apply enough (or remove enough) throttle to get the little "box" out of the acceptable range.

Now that I think about it though, I do remember people saying that the speed holds better when you get the little "box" near the top of the acceptable range. Do you ever hear the warning beep indicating you have fallen out of the cruise range?

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thethrillofspeed

Set it to RPM mode, much better. Mine drives me nuts pulling a wakeboarder using the MPH setting, but is just fine using the RPM mode. Skiing either mode works fine.

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Sandbagger

Also, I would definitely check the paddlewheel, as already mentioned.

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Matt_Alger

I have the Hammerhead and have the same problem (+/- 1.5 mph) with the Malibu Cruise while wakeboarding. My dealer told me that there was an adjustment with how much the Malibu Cruise let the speed float. However, I have read the book and can't find an adjustment. I do insure the throttle is in the middle of the box or slightly to the high side (that was the dealer's first suggestion). Frankly, a good driver can hold better speed for wakeboarders manually than the Malibu Cruise... probably because they can anticipate when they are making their cuts that cause extra drag. The Malibu Cruise seems to hold speed better at slalom speeds and in RPM mode. However, RPM mode at wakeboard speeds doesn't do any better that speed mode.

Also, I beg to differ with CedarLake Skier, you can easily tell the difference between 17 and 20 mph and it is a huge change, even if gradually moving between the speeds. I don't think too many people are happy with going 17 mph sometimes and 20 mph other times while wakeboarding. I will be honest, I am not good enough to tell +/- 0.5 mph but +/- 1 mph is obvious when I am wakeboarding.

My question is: Is perfect pass any better for wakeboarding than malibu Cruise and therefore would it be worth the additional cost?

Edited by Matt_Alger

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Sandbagger
I have the Hammerhead and have the same problem (+/- 1.5 mph) with the Malibu Cruise while wakeboarding. My dealer told me that there was an adjustment with how much the Malibu Cruise let the speed float. However, I have read the book and can't find an adjustment. I do insure the throttle is in the middle of the box or slightly to the high side (that was the dealer's first suggestion). Frankly, a good driver can hold better speed for wakeboarders manually than the Malibu Cruise... probably because they can anticipate when they are making their cuts that cause extra drag. The Malibu Cruise seems to hold speed better at slalom speeds and in RPM mode. However, RPM mode at wakeboard speeds doesn't do any better that speed mode.

Also, I beg to differ with CedarLake Skier, you can easily tell the difference between 17 and 20 mph and it is a huge change, even if gradually moving between the speeds. I don't think too many people are happy with going 17 mph sometimes and 20 mph other times while wakeboarding. I will be honest, I am not good enough to tell +/- 0.5 mph but +/- 1 mph is obvious when I am wakeboarding.

My question is: Is perfect pass any better for wakeboarding than malibu Cruise and therefore would it be worth the additional cost?

I doubt a driver can do better than the speed control, at least not without constant monitoring of the speedometer, and that would certainly take away from the drivers ability to properly monitor traffic, rider, water conditions etc.

I also believe that the paddle wheel is not completely accurate due to too many variables in water flow, a system based on GPS would be much more accurate.

Edited by Sandbagger

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skicrave
I doubt a driver can do better than the speed control, at least not without constant monitoring of the speedometer, and that would certainly take away from the drivers ability to properly monitor traffic, rider, water conditions etc.

Good driver's (especially those that grew up pulling slalom before the advent of speed control) do this constantly, and are MUCH better than any speed control system. Travis Moye, for example, drives for the pro tour and pulls the world's best wakeboarders in an X-Star with obscene amounts of weight without using speed control.

One thing to be sure of is to make sure you pull the rider up and accelerate to the set speed as if there was no speed control system on the boat. Too many times I hear or see people claiming you can just floor it and let the boat take over. While that will work (even with Malibu Cruise), the speed flucuation that results is exactly what you describe. If you accelerate smoothly right up to the set speed, the system will take over flawlessly and the deviation from the set speed will be much smaller.

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DONTW8

You will get better speed modulation with a lower pitch prop. With the load you are talking about your engine may be lugging somewhat at that speed. By switching to a lower pitch prop your engine will be turning 200 to 600 rpm's more and be more in it's power band and therefore able to hold the exact speed better.

Think of it this way. If you're driving uphill pulling a load in your truck and you shift down to 4th gear from 5th gear you are able to hold the exact speed easier.

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Sandbagger
I doubt a driver can do better than the speed control, at least not without constant monitoring of the speedometer, and that would certainly take away from the drivers ability to properly monitor traffic, rider, water conditions etc.

Good driver's (especially those that grew up pulling slalom before the advent of speed control) do this constantly, and are MUCH better than any speed control system. Travis Moye, for example, drives for the pro tour and pulls the world's best wakeboarders in an X-Star with obscene amounts of weight without using speed control.

One thing to be sure of is to make sure you pull the rider up and accelerate to the set speed as if there was no speed control system on the boat. Too many times I hear or see people claiming you can just floor it and let the boat take over. While that will work (even with Malibu Cruise), the speed flucuation that results is exactly what you describe. If you accelerate smoothly right up to the set speed, the system will take over flawlessly and the deviation from the set speed will be much smaller.

If a driver can learn to drive much better than using speed control then I would say learn to drive and forget about speed control. But a professional driver on a course does not have as many other factors to deal with, all he has to do is drive straight and at proper speed, and thats about it, recreationally there are many other driving responsibilities besides driving straight and keeping speed. Lets just say we have not found a driver that is better than speed control, rather than argue the point any further.

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skicrave
If a driver can learn to drive much better than using speed control then I would say learn to drive and forget about speed control. But a professional driver on a course does not have as many other factors to deal with, all he has to do is drive straight and at proper speed, and thats about it, recreationally there are many other driving responsibilities besides driving straight and keeping speed. Lets just say we have not found a driver that is better than speed control, rather than argue the point any further.

I don't think we're argueing, rather I think this is an on topic discussion. I think speed control is a revolution for 90% of boat owners that don't know they should keep the speed as close to the requested speed as possible. For the other 10% that are clued in it's still a huge convenience factor, when it works right. But driving straight and managing the speed yourself really isn't a distraction from the other tasks of driving, and it doesn't take much work to learn how.

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Sandbagger
If a driver can learn to drive much better than using speed control then I would say learn to drive and forget about speed control. But a professional driver on a course does not have as many other factors to deal with, all he has to do is drive straight and at proper speed, and thats about it, recreationally there are many other driving responsibilities besides driving straight and keeping speed. Lets just say we have not found a driver that is better than speed control, rather than argue the point any further.

I don't think we're argueing, rather I think this is an on topic discussion. I think speed control is a revolution for 90% of boat owners that don't know they should keep the speed as close to the requested speed as possible. For the other 10% that are clued in it's still a huge convenience factor, when it works right. But driving straight and managing the speed yourself really isn't a distraction from the other tasks of driving, and it doesn't take much work to learn how.

Yea but, considering other variables such as boat traffic, rollers and wind factors I believe that speed control will not only work better than the driver but also allow the driver to relax and concentrate on other responsibilities.

Besides since the thread is regarding speed control, are there any systems that use GPS as a speed indicator? I have also heard Perfect Pass is more precises than the Malibu system. Mine is an 07 VLX and it will vary about 1.5 MPH either way.

Edited by Sandbagger

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Ache For Wake

I have the Perfect Pass Stargazer Wake Edition and it is sweet, but like Skicrave said, when I am heavily loaded it still needs a little help sometimes from the driver. If I am moderatly loaded it will hold speed right on, even in the corners, but I wouldn't say that it is extremely better than Malibu Cruise.

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cyoda44

Thanks to everyone for the very enjoyable discussion.... Notworthy.gif I plan on trying everyones sugestions and responding with what workes for me.

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2008vlx

last year i had a 2008 VLX and this year the 2009 (both on the diamond Hull), the 2009 speed control is more nervous (too much) it adjust the engine very often and with more trottle. i don't think this is more efficency

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Matt_Alger
I have the Perfect Pass Stargazer Wake Edition and it is sweet, but like Skicrave said, when I am heavily loaded it still needs a little help sometimes from the driver. If I am moderatly loaded it will hold speed right on, even in the corners, but I wouldn't say that it is extremely better than Malibu Cruise.

Thanks for your feelings on Perfect Pass vs Malibu Cruise. I was hoping that someone would reply with their feelings on this.

I also didn't expect to start a discussion regarding if a person could hold better speed than Malibu Cruise. Frankly, I was surprised that people don't feel they can hold better than +/- 1.5 mph when driving. I think that because this is the first time that I have had speed control on my boat, it has forced me to be a better driver over the past 20 years. Maybe I just "think" that I am better than I am and the person who usually drives for me is really better than Malibu Cruise. I can certainly tell that he holds speed better than Malibu Cruise.

Edited by Matt_Alger

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99response

I would still give RPM mode a try, always seemed much smoother than speed based.

-Chris

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WakeGirl
You will get better speed modulation with a lower pitch prop. With the load you are talking about your engine may be lugging somewhat at that speed. By switching to a lower pitch prop your engine will be turning 200 to 600 rpm's more and be more in it's power band and therefore able to hold the exact speed better.

Think of it this way. If you're driving uphill pulling a load in your truck and you shift down to 4th gear from 5th gear you are able to hold the exact speed easier.

I suspect this is the answer to the question. An LCR in that boat with 9 adults....get an OJ 468 & be done with it.

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Malibudude
You will get better speed modulation with a lower pitch prop. With the load you are talking about your engine may be lugging somewhat at that speed. By switching to a lower pitch prop your engine will be turning 200 to 600 rpm's more and be more in it's power band and therefore able to hold the exact speed better.

Think of it this way. If you're driving uphill pulling a load in your truck and you shift down to 4th gear from 5th gear you are able to hold the exact speed easier.

I suspect this is the answer to the question. An LCR in that boat with 9 adults....get an OJ 468 & be done with it.

Bingo that is the root of the problem. I'll respectfully disagree 99% out there could drive better with the current engine prop setup, the engine is just working so hard to keep the speed that adding that much weight just won’t happen. I can hold speed much better w/ the 468 than the 537 stock prop though I do usually use Malibu Cruise.

Even on Perfect Pass it still has problems and many nuances that need adjustment by the driver.

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water_junky
Has anyone had a problem with the cruise speed varing alot.

Situation was.... I picked up my new VTX last Saturday. It has a LCR 320 and an acme 537 prop. My wife was wakeboarding at 18mph and the cruise was all over the place. Varing from 20 to 17 mph. As I was driving you could hear the engine rev's going up and down drastically. When she finished her shortened run "could not take the constant change in speed" she ask if I had not turned on the cruise. "she sometimes forgets to turn on the cruise for me"

The boat was loaded fairly well with 9 adults.

I ask my dealer if there was an adjustment for the cruise and was told there was not one.

My question is.... How can I fix this problem?

I took my 2009 VLX out for the first time yesterday and it was just my wife and I and the water was like glass the cruise control was out of control!!! The boat has a Hammerhead, 537 prop, empty ballast, and the wedge was up. It was horrible, there is no way I would ski with that!! Vomit.gif I will try the some of the suggestions that people have made, but when you pay as much as we pay for these boats you shouldn't have to switch to RPM's to get it to work, it should work either way. Mad.gif

Terry

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99response
Has anyone had a problem with the cruise speed varing alot.

Situation was.... I picked up my new VTX last Saturday. It has a LCR 320 and an acme 537 prop. My wife was wakeboarding at 18mph and the cruise was all over the place. Varing from 20 to 17 mph. As I was driving you could hear the engine rev's going up and down drastically. When she finished her shortened run "could not take the constant change in speed" she ask if I had not turned on the cruise. "she sometimes forgets to turn on the cruise for me"

The boat was loaded fairly well with 9 adults.

I ask my dealer if there was an adjustment for the cruise and was told there was not one.

My question is.... How can I fix this problem?

I took my 2009 VLX out for the first time yesterday and it was just my wife and I and the water was like glass the cruise control was out of control!!! The boat has a Hammerhead, 537 prop, empty ballast, and the wedge was up. It was horrible, there is no way I would ski with that!! Vomit.gif I will try the some of the suggestions that people have made, but when you pay as much as we pay for these boats you shouldn't have to switch to RPM's to get it to work, it should work either way. Mad.gif

Terry

Were you skiing with speed mode? If your going much above 26-27 MPH you should be in RPM mode

-Chris

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water_junky
Has anyone had a problem with the cruise speed varing alot.

Situation was.... I picked up my new VTX last Saturday. It has a LCR 320 and an acme 537 prop. My wife was wakeboarding at 18mph and the cruise was all over the place. Varing from 20 to 17 mph. As I was driving you could hear the engine rev's going up and down drastically. When she finished her shortened run "could not take the constant change in speed" she ask if I had not turned on the cruise. "she sometimes forgets to turn on the cruise for me"

The boat was loaded fairly well with 9 adults.

I ask my dealer if there was an adjustment for the cruise and was told there was not one.

My question is.... How can I fix this problem?

I took my 2009 VLX out for the first time yesterday and it was just my wife and I and the water was like glass the cruise control was out of control!!! The boat has a Hammerhead, 537 prop, empty ballast, and the wedge was up. It was horrible, there is no way I would ski with that!! Vomit.gif I will try the some of the suggestions that people have made, but when you pay as much as we pay for these boats you shouldn't have to switch to RPM's to get it to work, it should work either way. Mad.gif

Terry

Were you skiing with speed mode? If your going much above 26-27 MPH you should be in RPM mode

-Chris

No, when we are skiing we are Sky Skiing which is 23 to 25 mph. We weren't doing anything behind the boat we were just making sure everything worked and the speed was set at 23 which is my wife speed when she Sky Skis. It was the first time out on the boat.

Terry

Edited by water_junky

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JohnDoe

3 words: PERFECT PASS CLASSIC!!!

Many variables you can adjust, absolutely no problem holding any speeds, regardless of weight. The ONLY complaint will be that it gases you as you're approaching the wake, but that can be tweaked. For you '09 owners out there, you may want to check with your dealer about using zero off, but I don't have experience with ZO and heavy ballast.

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