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Barefooting Basics ?


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  • VinRLX

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Well we did about 3 hrs at the lake today, but without the proper wet suit (lots of padding) It was just to rough for footing. I did get 4 passes at the bouy course and 3 sets on my wake board though. Wow do I need some more practice at both.

This summer maybe we should hit the lake 3 days a week. Yahoo.gif

Joe

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I would suggest that you get used to riding on your butt with your legs in front of you and your feet flat, just skimming the top of the water.  While the boom is going to hold you up and give you a false sense of security, it is good to get used to riding on your butt with your feet skimming in a true 3pt position.

Mark, does boom height add/subract to the false sense of security you mentioned? I can do the front deep and ride on my butt no problem w/5' line. Am planning on LL this summer and just wondering the difference in feel. Baby.gif

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Mark, does boom height add/subract to the false sense of security you mentioned? I can do the front deep and ride on my butt no problem w/5' line. Am planning on LL this summer and just wondering the difference in feel. 

This is a bit of a mental game, but at first, that is a big part of the equation.

The biggest problem beginners have with LL is that the rope is right at the water level and you actually get pulled forward. On the 5', you have a bit of an upward pull and this is a great thing, but it gets you spoiled!!!! Many people bury their feet on their first few LL attempts because of this forward pull.

An extended pylon/tower will help some, but LL is still a forward pull. The best thing I can tell you is make sure as soon as the boat starts, you get back on your shoulders and get your butt up as high as possible. In 2 - 3 seconds, you will be riding on your shoulders ready to transition to your butt exactly the same as the 5'.

Dont forget, you are now gonna have to learn how to cheek out to one curl or the other which is another fun thing to deal with LL so you dont get stuck in the prop wash.

As for you original question. I don't think any specific height is better or worse for front deep on the 5'.

Edited by martho
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Thanks for the post. I don't have the boom very high, but as you say it is still an upward pull.

In 2 - 3 seconds, you will be riding on your shoulders ready to transition to your butt exactly the same as the 5'.

This is very encouraging, actually, and I'm getting more stoked to try it this summer. Any difference for a first-timer at 75 or 90' of rope?

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Jack,

It depends on the boat. With some you want to get a bit further back for cleaner water, but by doing that you're also pushed a bit further outside of the centerline due to the wake, which means there's a bit more pull from the boat forcing you back inside the wake.

Barefootcentral.com did a barefoot boat review and recommended different rope lengths for the different boats they tested. The RLX was one of them and they suggested a rope length of 85'.

Mike

Edited by mlange
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Cool, thanks Mike. Don't necessarily care as much about cleaner water for the first few times. Just want to get up. Sounds like I might be better off using a 75 so I can cheek out and stand up without being pulled back to the center?

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If you are worried about a cheek out, try a 60' rope. You will be right on the hump and it will send out out one way or the other with little effort. The last few times out I have just used the 15 off slalom rope for my runs. It is a bit stretchy, but for a simple front deep and no tricks, it is fine. It was easier than pulling out the barefoot rope and handle. YMMV

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Yes,

The bummer with a stretchy(if that is a word) rope is that you get pulled forward/fall back/pulled forward/etc etc. When this happens you start to get out of position and it is no fun. A non stretch rope will really help you LL as it keeps you from getting yanked around.

BarefootOzz has a spectra line, but I dont know which one.

I have this Barefoot International rope

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jack, one other thing you can try to help with the cheeck out, is to start way outside the wake on the pull up. this is a method that i prefer. i find that since i am in the widest part of the wake at startup, it helps me stay there.

another reason for a trip to RI, i can help u with the LL Front deep...just got my new drysuit this week, hopefully break it in early next week!

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Yes,

The bummer with a stretchy(if that is a word) rope is that you get pulled forward/fall back/pulled forward/etc etc.  When this happens you start to get out of position and it is no fun. A non stretch rope will really help you LL as it keeps you from getting yanked around.

BarefootOzz has a spectra line, but I dont know which one.

I have this Barefoot International rope

VinRLX,

Martho is right!... Here's what I use, makes big difference.

Spectra MicroFusion

Good Luck!... Thumbup.gif

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I use a Tak-Line, which I'm guessing is the same thing that Martho's got.

While I've never used Spectra line, I have heard that it feels much more like being on the boom because you don't have that stretch/retract thing going on that Martho described, which even occurs a little bit with the Tak-Line.

Regarding your cheek out... it really isn't hard at all after you get the feeling for it and you can always drag your outside hand to help until you learn to do it with both hands on the handle better. Just take your time and play around a bit until you get the feel for it. It definitely shouldn't be a struggle. You should be able to sit back, relax, and be very comfortable until you're ready to go to your three-point.

Oh, almost forgot, you can always just have your driver help you by doing a quick/small turn to kinda whip you out.

Mike

Edited by mlange
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The way we teach beginning barefooters is the traditional step off of a ski on a boom. We took an old double ski, removed the bindings and put grip tape. It is fat and fairly easy to get up on. Step off with the back foot first and slowly plant it in the water next to the front foot. Once most of your weight is on the water planted foot, the ski will simply come out from underneath the other foot. Naturally you even out your weight and you are up.

The next step is the tumble up on the boom. Because the boom absolutely gives a false sense of security, we graduate to the 5' rope then the long line. The first deep water start is usually on a 5' rope with your feet on the rope until you are planing on your butt.

My best suggestion is to go to a Seipel or Scarpa barefoot camp for 2 days. It is fantastic instruction.

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I am against the step off method of teaching.

I think it just adds an element which will need to be removed later. With a boom, there is no need for a step off. Everyone has their own training methods and can be successful. My method just doesn't include skis.

I am looking for some video of my early runs to show you what not to do in the 3 point. As soon as I have it, I will post some pix from the videos.

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Here is an older video.

This video is from 2002. This is one of my earlier attempts at front deep on the 5' rope. I won't point out all the mistakes as there are a bunch of them.

However, handle position and arm position in this video are bad. My arms should not be pulled in as I stand. Also, in the three pt, my legs are swinging all over the place and I look like a toy on a string. Also, if you watch, I use the rope not just to support my legs, but I actually push up on the rope to arch myself out of the water. Mybutt is low and I am using the rope to cheat and not push my waist upward upon take-off. Another no-no. This vid is humbling :blush:

For those of you working on front deep (Jack/Joe) keep these things in mind when you watch this.

Hopefully Oz will throw in some tips to keep you from looking like me in these runs. Also, once I get up, my stance is horrible. However, we will concentrate on front deep right now Tongue.gif

Edited by martho
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Ok, after getting the vid I can say my start is much different. Don't have a way of posting it, sorry. Boom for me is definitely lower and I get pulled through the water more.

I also believe stepping off is not the best way to learn--whether you have a boom or not.

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I agree with Mark regarding the step off method.

Having said that, I was down at Scarpas last spring and that is how he was teaching someone.

I also spent a couple of days with Paul Stokes last year and he taught my son by having him hang his feet over the cables while holding onto the boom and then just dropping his butt into the water.

I guess everyone has their own way and while I'm not a step off fan, I'm certainly not one to argue with Scarpa on his method. :)

Mike

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WakeGirl,

I will make sure that Mrs. Martho reads his last post!... Mad.gif

The answer to your question would be the same as a man. I'm not sure if you have barefooted before or tried to deep water but assuming you have not and since you're familiar with a wakeboard I would suggest your first tried it on the wakeboard. Take the biddings off, sit far back on the board, hold the front sides of the board with the inner sides of your feet or toes, have the boat driver take off SLOW and stay somewhere around the 12 to 15 MPH, put your feet on top of the board, by pushing down with your feet move your butt forward as far as you can, KEEPING YOUR KNEES TOGETHER, put your feet on the water slightly on the side of the board by spreading your feet apart, DO NOTHING FROM THIS POINT ON, have the boat driver pick up speed to 30 or 32 MPH depending on your weight, KEEP YOUR KNEES TOGETHER AT ALL TIMES, depending on how much spray you're getting ask the boat driver to increase boat speed, stay on a exaggerated sitting position. Take a look at this good looking chick barefooting, look at her hips and knees position, this is at low speed, 28 to 32 MPH

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WakeGirl,

I will make sure that Mrs. Martho reads his last post!...  Mad.gif 

The answer to your question would be the same as a man. I'm not sure if you have barefooted before or tried to deep water but assuming you have not and since you're familiar with a wakeboard I would suggest your first tried it on the wakeboard. Take the biddings off, sit far back on the board, hold the front sides of the board with the inner sides of your feet or toes, have the boat driver take off SLOW and stay somewhere around the 12 to 15 MPH, put your feet on top of the board, by pushing down with your feet move your butt forward as far as you can, KEEPING YOUR KNEES TOGETHER, put your feet on the water slightly on the side of the board by spreading your feet apart, DO NOTHING FROM THIS POINT ON, have the boat driver pick up speed to 30 or 32 MPH depending on your weight, KEEP YOUR KNEES TOGETHER AT ALL TIMES, depending on how much spray you're getting ask the boat driver to increase boat speed, stay on a exaggerated sitting position. Take a look at this good looking chick barefooting, look at her hips and knees position, this is at low speed, 28 to 32 MPH

Right on! I don't think I need the board to do it though. I've never tried it that way - I tried it one time & that was on a boom laying out "superman" position. I was able to get myself around but I didn't plant my feet evenly & it spun me back around. This was after a full weekend of boarding & my body just wouldn't cooperate for getting back around so I had to quit. That was my first exposure to a boom, & we now have one so I'm game to give it a go.

I'd rather learn it right than having to come off of some type of board each time. The wallies on our lake seem to think that we leave those behind for them. Mad.gif

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