Check out this new Malibu boat???

[NorCaliBu]

In fact, that was even more lame than the imitation Illusion tower that started this thread...this has become a copious cornicopia of lameness. Congrat's Jack.

[WakeGirl]

What' the Tige sales guy going to say to a prospective buyer that asks about Tige engineering and design.?

By copying other manufacturers' designs and styling Tige validates the design and styling of other boat manufacturer design. Tige is only going to be able to sell on price and they can say they are fast followers of designs and engineering not tbe trend setters. It is very similar to the ipod and all of the copycat versions that came after it Look how "wakecraft" advertizes their product-"just like a malibu"

Someone had to foot the bill for the original design effort on the illusion tower. I am not a historian but if what I read is correct Titan made the first Illusion tower. So did Titan do the styling and engineering and then knock on the door of Malibu and say hey look at what we got for you? I think not. I think Malibu engineering driven by their own marketing department came up with the illusion stying and looked for a manufacturer to design maybe even co-develop the original illusion design. I am gonna go out on a limb and make an educated guess the the malibu engineering department does not have in-house experts on aluminum casting so they looked for a vendor that did and I bet that malibu had an exclusive on the design for some period of time which was also a function of NRE and number of units sold along with price.

How Metcraft got involved I don't know but I bet as long as it is not an exact copy of malibu's illusion design, what did Metcraft do wrong.? I am sure if one of these companies violated a contractual obligation or stole some IP we will see a court case soon.

What would really be interesting to see on the Tige tower is if any improvements were made to the hinge mechanism when folding and how well that all works or doesn't compared with Malibu's design.

I still see Tige as a copycat and I think the market will too, but what do I know? I am relative newby to owning a Malibu and when I was shopping for a boat I never considered a Tige after looking at it in a dealership, the quality just didn't impress me.

(All this typed with 2 thumbs on my blackberry;) the wife thinks I am crazy.

-Dave

haha, I think I've gotta agree with your wife. longest thing I've written on my treo is about 1/3 of what you just wrote.

as for malibu designing the tower... since metcraft has the patent I'd be willing to bet that they were the original designers of the tower. malibu would have patented it themselves if they had designed it. the "story" I've heard is that Metcraft designed the tower and then shopped it around to boat manufacturers until malibu signed on(malibu was not the first company they brought it to).

It looks like Metcraft does have a patent on the tower, I'd be interested to see what is done about the extremely similar look. Couldn't find anything on Tige patenting their tower ( I doubt they even checked ). Here is the metcraft tower patent number D442,910.

the way I look at it is this: Tige decided to put a Metcraft tower on their boats. it's that simple. if another manufacturer put a Titan tower on their boats would they be malibu rip-offs too?

Titan built the original Illusion in '03. It was a tube style, different from the current Illusion X. But it was still the first forward sweeping tower. It wasn't continued because the Metcraft design was leagues better in terms of function. As far as Metcraft "shopping it around", I find that very difficult to believe given that Malibu had already had the forward sweeping tower for a full year prior to Metcraft introducing this design (Illusion X came in '04). The only part of that that makes sense is that other boat manufacturers wouldn't be quick to go for a new design that hadn't received good press, hadn't proven to be a good design, & had already appeared on the competition's boat. Now that it is proven, it's ripe for other manufacturers to copy.

FIC,

I think that they're saying that some boat manufacturers continue to innovate & find ways of incorporating new ideas. That has been Malibu's MO for a very long time. As an example of the other end of that spectrum (builders that follow), Tige only just recently (2-3 years ago) began building all-glass boats. They're hardly known as an innovative company in the boating world.

[WakeGirl]

With few exceptions these boats are aimed at different markets and have different design philosophies. There is room for everyone in this market.

....

Keep in mind that as all the auto manufacturers together tried to cheat the wind and expand the inside space all the cars started to look the same. You have to walk right up to them and read the name plate now, but no one is suing anyone else.

The 2 best statements of the entire thread. Apples & oranges.

[Oldskeer]

A Tige' will never have the resale value of a Malibu. It'll never drive like a Malibu. It'll never ski like a Malibu. Itll never have the ergonomics of a Malibu.

[Arctic Slalom]

I'll probably get hammered for this but when you look at them side by side, I think the Tige is a little sleeker looking, kinda like a new Sunsetter Lxi or vlx

I can't disagree but maybe easier to take water over the bow?

yep, that bow really does look low, especially with how calm the water is.....

perhaps it is 'loaded for bear' with ballast

[mtodd]

Hopefully their marketing department has more money than their engineering dept. They could put the pickle fork and the tower together and call them a Masterbu or Malicraft.

[javamans]

just as a side note, one reason i didn't buy the tige 24ve is that the malibu 247rx was cheaper???? i know its not a vdrive but it still has a transfer case which is one reason vdrives are more

Edited July 2, 2008 by javamans

[CumminsBu]

Buddy of mine had a 1994 Tige CB that we used for wake boarding, I know not the best but did us just fine. I thought it had a horrible ride in anything but glass. The double ups, man that was like riding a bull. All in all the Tige was better than the Seaswirl I/O before that.

[Gravana]

I'm pretty sure every boat mfg. and tower mfg. had to pay royalties to use a front and rear legged wakeboard tower to CC (?) I'm sure Malibu patented their Illusion tower.

I did a quick search on the USPTO's website and only found four issued patents to Malibu Boats:

7,140,318: covers their wedge

6,647,915: covers their windshield assembly

5,211,592: covers their fiberglass engine chassis stringers

5,018,474: covers their swivel head pylon

It is possible that they filed a patent on the tower, which is still pending but not issued (doubtful though). It is also possible that an assignment for this elusive patent has not been recorded in their name or was recorded in a different name, in which case my down and dirty search wouldn't uncover it.

I wasn't talking about patent coverage. I am more focusing on the trademark issue, since I think Malibu has a lot of brand recognition wrapped up in their forward swept tower design.

I took a tour of their Merced, CA factory last year. I recall the gal giving the tour saying that they had a few patents. I was actually surprised at how few patents they have, particularly since they are located only 2 hour outside Silicon Valley--the mecca of patent law firms (even my firm is home based their)--and they market themselves as a cutting edge R&D boat company.

They may have had an option to file for a utility patent on the IT, but that look has been on boats for years, so a design patent would be ruled out. Utility is always better, as it covers function over fashion, which makes it tougher to copy and easier to win in litigation.

Jim

PS - If you think people are up in arms about Tige's tower, wait until they announce (or did they already?) their new powerplants from MP...

[FIC]

We are a full service facility that is certified for warrantee on indmar, pcm, marine power and mercruiser, as such we work on mastercraft, malibu , correct craft, centurion, tige or any boat with those power plants , we also take care of and sponsor 2 ski teams and both of my sons are professional skiiers, and as I said before I respect each brand for its abilities and each brand has its faults. I dont see any one brand haveing more innovation then an other. On a side note pertaining to the picklefork design, again I say who copyed who , picklefork or sponson bows came out in the earley 1960s long before mastercraft exsisted, cobalt brought the picklefork back out aprox, 16 years ago followed by mastercraft aprox, 9 years ago the tige, and mb boats with there tom cat. History always repeats itself. All of the manufactures have had ther innovations and have copyed in one way or another, its in evitable. Most think that in 1996 when correct craft came out with the tsc hulls which had spray pockets that they invented it but tige boats had massive spray pockets from 1991 to 2000 which earned them the best slalomn boat honors for 3 years in a row . We need to be proud that these are all american boats and designs , and with that being said have a good fourth of july.

[VinRLX]

but tige boats had massive spray pockets from 1991 to 2000

I think that was from the knot holes in the wood?

[zad0030]

PS - If you think people are up in arms about Tige's tower, wait until they announce (or did they already?) their new powerplants from MP...

Tige is switching to PCM, and leaving MP..

[zad0030]

Fuel for the fire

New Dash

[LiQUiDSX]

Fuel for the fire

New Dash

[SmoothWaterMan]

We are a full service facility that is certified for warrantee on indmar, pcm, marine power and mercruiser, as such we work on mastercraft, malibu , correct craft, centurion, tige or any boat with those power plants , we also take care of and sponsor 2 ski teams and both of my sons are professional skiiers, and as I said before I respect each brand for its abilities and each brand has its faults. I dont see any one brand haveing more innovation then an other. On a side note pertaining to the picklefork design, again I say who copyed who , picklefork or sponson bows came out in the earley 1960s long before mastercraft exsisted, cobalt brought the picklefork back out aprox, 16 years ago followed by mastercraft aprox, 9 years ago the tige, and mb boats with there tom cat. History always repeats itself. All of the manufactures have had ther innovations and have copyed in one way or another, its in evitable. Most think that in 1996 when correct craft came out with the tsc hulls which had spray pockets that they invented it but tige boats had massive spray pockets from 1991 to 2000 which earned them the best slalomn boat honors for 3 years in a row . We need to be proud that these are all american boats and designs , and with that being said have a good fourth of july.

Tige? In '91? That was Ski Centurion hull..... but I understand what you're saying. Just a big cycle.

[Killer]

my 1990 nautique had spray relief pockets...

[pennery]

Looks like that Tige Dash has Rider Presets. Or at least Memory Settings...

[JasonK]

Check out the towers on Svfara boats. Looks like an Illusion too.

http://www.svfara.com/

[UWSkier]

Once you add the bimini, they look awfully familiar....

Sweet! You can get a Tigebu or TigeCraft all at the same dealer!

[yabetcha]

Since the '09 Malibu boats no longer have Metcraft towers, it's no suprise that Metcraft is making similiar towers for other manufacturers. Why would Metcraft drastically change the design when the Illusion towers where very popular on Malibu boats. Metcraft has established themselves with the casted forward sweeping tower--look at the Centurion towers too.

It also looks like Nautique is offering similar designed towers. Is Tige copying Nautique because the shape is simliar?

[FIC]

my 1990 nautique had spray relief pockets...

1990 Nautique had a narrowoed tail no spray pockets , nautique came out with spray pockets in 1996 with their tsc hull which stood for total surface control , spray pockets are cut out sections in the bottom sides of the boat just behind the mid point where the water spray would normally shoot a spray into the air and your slalomn skiier couldnt see the next bouy , so the pockets forced the spray down, the narrowed tail only narrows the wake .

[Chef23]

A Tige' will never have the resale value of a Malibu. It'll never drive like a Malibu. It'll never ski like a Malibu. Itll never have the ergonomics of a Malibu.

I don't know what the strategic plans for Tige are but my guess is that when the first Malibus hit the water people said the same thing that a Malibu would never drive like a CC or MC or ski like one.

If you remember the first Honda Civic certainly nobody thought about the current Accord or Acuras that are manufactured by them.

I don't know where it will wind up but I think all the competition is a good thing as competition drives innovation even if it is in the form of Malibu wanting to improve on the companies that might be leveraging their ideas.

Edited July 30, 2008 by Chef23

[Malibudude]

Since the '09 Malibu boats no longer have Metcraft towers, it's no suprise that Metcraft is making similiar towers for other manufacturers. Why would Metcraft drastically change the design when the Illusion towers where very popular on Malibu boats. Metcraft has established themselves with the casted forward sweeping tower--look at the Centurion towers too.

It also looks like Nautique is offering similar designed towers. Is Tige copying Nautique because the shape is simliar?

Metcraft is still building Illusion X and Illusion XS. The Titan is an optional tower.

[Gravana]

A Tige' will never have the resale value of a Malibu. It'll never drive like a Malibu. It'll never ski like a Malibu. Itll never have the ergonomics of a Malibu.

I don't know what the strategic plans for Tige are but my guess is that when the first Malibus hit the water people said the same thing that a Malibu would never drive like a CC or MC or ski like one.

If you remember the first Honda Civic certainly nobody thought about the current Accord or Acuras that are manufactured by them.

I don't know where it will wind up but I think all the competition is a good thing as competition drives innovation even if it is in the form of Malibu wanting to improve on the companies that might be leveraging their ideas.

I agree with you. However, with innovation-driven competition comes increased prices in most cases. Luckily for these boat manufacturers, consumers are not demanding lower prices. In my business, customers used to demand innovative products. Now, the #1 question we get is, "What can I do to make my vehicle perform/handle/ride/look better WITHOUT affecting fuel economy?", followed closely by, "Do you have anything less expensive?". Like the boat industry, my aftermarket parts business is "Want" driven and not "Need" driven. We used to sell far more cat-back exhaust systems than headers for gas trucks and SUVs. Now, we sell more headers (50-state legal models) than cat-backs simply due to the fuel economy increases. For diesels, we have a hard time keeping mileage-proven programemrs in stock.

On the flip side, I have 4-5 friends in the market for a new Malibu who have all started looking at 1-3 year old boats. For months they have talked about the cool and innovative upgrades on the new boats, but the reality is that they will give that up for a lower price.

I am just as guilty. I want a brand new WS 247, but I would sell my WS LSV in a heartbeat if I found the right deal on a pre-owned 247.

Jim

[mw23LSV]

Before deciding on the Malibu we tested the Tige as well:

The Malibu is a much better boat, however there were some great things on the Tige.

The vent seat is very comfortable and allows for air to circulate.

There are small ice chests on the back of the Tige which could be accessed from the swim platform which could come in handy.

The front seats of the bow lift up giving front access to the storage under the drivers seat and dash.

As for the towers go we were told that Metcalf came up with a new design for Malibu but Malibu decided to take their production of the towers overseas to save money so Tige picked up the metcalf tower design.

I think it is a great compliment if someone/something wants to be like you.