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Portugue

Can I Wake surf w/o Ballasts?

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Portugue

I have a 02 23ft with no ballasts or sacks and I would like to try wake surfing. What do I need to be able to do it and let go of the rope?

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SacRiverRat

You can wakesurf, but doubt you'll be able to go ropeless, or get much of a shapely wave. Give it a shot -

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crescentbar
I have a 02 23ft with no ballasts or sacks and I would like to try wake surfing. What do I need to be able to do it and let go of the rope?

Bring lots of friends. Bigger the better!

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Ronnie

Can you? Maybe, depends on how many friends you bring. Will you like the wave? No.

If you're going to surf, you'll get more ballast, might as well go ahead and get it. You'll need a little more with that hull too. You are fighting the lifting action of that hull and it needs more ballast than the wake hull.

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2wayskier
I have a 02 23ft with no ballasts or sacks and I would like to try wake surfing. What do I need to be able to do it and let go of the rope?

Bring lots of friends. Bigger the better!

I agree regarding the friends. We used to wake surf in the 60's behind mahogany boats with no fat sacks, just friends. They are easier to move side to side.

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NorCaliBu
You'll need a little more with that hull too. You are fighting the lifting action of that hull and it needs more ballast than the wake hull.

I find it hard to believe that the lifting strakes on a diamond hull would have any effect at ~10 mph with uneven weight distribution. :unsure: BIHBWB. Dontknow.gif

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Ronnie

Why not? That's what they were designed to do. In our experience it does. The 23 WSLSV vs. 23 Sunscape LSV need to be weighted totally different and the 23SSLSV needs more weight.

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dhcomp

Definitely possible to surf w/o ballast.

With teh longer style wakesurf boards, its totally doable.

I have friends that have wakesurfed behind a 2007 Response LXI ropeless for a long time wiht a long board at 5 or 6 ppl and the wedge down.

With 4 or 5 ppl, i surfed my 08 Response LXI with the wedge down with a shorter style surf board, but not as easily.

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Deke
Definitely possible to surf w/o ballast.

With teh longer style wakesurf boards, its totally doable.

I have friends that have wakesurfed behind a 2007 Response LXI ropeless for a long time wiht a long board at 5 or 6 ppl and the wedge down.

With 4 or 5 ppl, i surfed my 08 Response LXI with the wedge down with a shorter style surf board, but not as easily.

I've actually done it on an NSP 6' fish behind my 99 Response LX with only 3 people and the wedge. VERY difficult! You are surfing the wake one second and surfing the platform the next! When you put on the brakes you go right out the back. The pocket is very small.

I was really hoping to hear from someone saying that they figured out how to weight a Response so that you can get away from the platform. I have only experimented briefly with ballast but have not really figured anything out. Speeding up a little starts to feel right in terms of wave shape but I can't keep up with the boat with this board. Any suggestions? I own two V-drive (400 lb) sacks but am not sure about placement.

Surfing is so much fun and you can do it when you don't have one more slalom set in you. But since slalom is my main sport I'm not willing to go to a more surf friendly boat.

Deke

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sunscapeJeff

We tried surfing behind ours with just friends and we could never get it. We then tried a tube sac, and that wasn't really enough. Once I learned how to wakesurf and go ropeless, I didn't need as much weight, but to figure it out at first, I needed the better wave (tgaugh's boat, I think it was) to really "get it". Now I go with two 400lbs in the surf-side rear locker, a tube sac under the surf-side seats, and I've added a bow sac this year, and that really improved the wake. Now we can surf with a crew as small as 3 or so.

I agree with Ronnie's thoughts on the 23-foot needing more weight. There are two things with that hull you have to fight, in my experience. First is the lifting action that it seems to have, and second is the bowrise. Even the Perfect Pass people know how much bowrise it has; they designed a "canoe" to put the paddlewheel deeper into the water.

Edited by sunscapeJeff

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sunscapeJeff
Definitely possible to surf w/o ballast.

With teh longer style wakesurf boards, its totally doable.

I have friends that have wakesurfed behind a 2007 Response LXI ropeless for a long time wiht a long board at 5 or 6 ppl and the wedge down.

With 4 or 5 ppl, i surfed my 08 Response LXI with the wedge down with a shorter style surf board, but not as easily.

I've actually done it on an NSP 6' fish behind my 99 Response LX with only 3 people and the wedge. VERY difficult! You are surfing the wake one second and surfing the platform the next! When you put on the brakes you go right out the back. The pocket is very small.

I was really hoping to hear from someone saying that they figured out how to weight a Response so that you can get away from the platform. I have only experimented briefly with ballast but have not really figured anything out. Speeding up a little starts to feel right in terms of wave shape but I can't keep up with the boat with this board. Any suggestions? I own two V-drive (400 lb) sacks but am not sure about placement.

Surfing is so much fun and you can do it when you don't have one more slalom set in you. But since slalom is my main sport I'm not willing to go to a more surf friendly boat.

Deke

We've surfed skiline00's Sunsetter Lxi before. We had several sacks lying all around, but it was definitely do-able. Just try to get those 400lb sacks as close to the rear surf-side corner as you can. I'm trying to remember how much weight we had, and I think it might've been something along the lines of 1200 lbs or so. IIRC, we had 2 v-drive sacks, and a couple more launch-pad sacks.

As far as speed, on our 23-foot boat, we have to run as fast as 11.5-12.5 to get a good wave shape (for me longer is better than taller). That makes it to where we can surf 10-15 feet back and still be able to get back into the pocket. Wouldn't a fish be slower than other boards? The reduced surface area in the tail of the board makes it slower, from what I understand. I've got a 6' ocean-style board, squash tail, that is incredibly slow. I can't keep up with the boat and almost any speed, it seems. I was really surprised by that when I first used it behind the boat.

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Brad B

We have surfed Phil's '96 VLX (1st year for VLX I think) with no ballast or wedge only his family.

Actually Todd did the surfing and I did the driving.

Board was the Red Tide I think

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Brad B
You'll need a little more with that hull too. You are fighting the lifting action of that hull and it needs more ballast than the wake hull.

I find it hard to believe that the lifting strakes on a diamond hull would have any effect at ~10 mph with uneven weight distribution. :unsure: BIHBWB. Dontknow.gif

Thats what I thought too untill we weighted Ronnie and Kens '04s and I needed even more on my diamond.

Of course we had Alvie the ultimate VAB.

But fighting these hull's tendency helps develop the wave too.

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Air Force 1

It depends on the board. They make boards for smaller wakes and beginners

AF1

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footnlongline
I have a 02 23ft with no ballasts or sacks and I would like to try wake surfing. What do I need to be able to do it and let go of the rope?

A board for certain

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LS-One
I have a 02 23ft with no ballasts or sacks and I would like to try wake surfing. What do I need to be able to do it and let go of the rope?

You need to be 5 or 6 years of age and weigh in at 35 lbs.

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Stevo
I have a 02 23ft with no ballasts or sacks and I would like to try wake surfing. What do I need to be able to do it and let go of the rope?

You need to be 5 or 6 years of age and weigh in at 35 lbs.

Yes you can do it, but the larger the wake the more fun you will have, ballast is not that expensive, it is just time consuming. I evaluate surfing based on the quality of the water.

Choppy white-caps = surfing. Butter =wake and Ski

water snob - out

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Malibusteve

I wakesurfed for the first time this weekend behind my VTX. Set up was as follows:

Factory port side rear tank full

Mid tank 1/2 full

wedge at 1200 position

driver only initially

Hyperlite Broadcast 5ft. 6in.

Me 170lbs. 2nd time at wakesurfing.

After an hour or so of getting the feel of the sweet spot was able to ride ropeless for a couple of minutes. The next day, setup was the same plus about 400lbs. of friends. Made all the difference in the world in ease of going ropeless and fun factor.

Also, board fit into the Titan racks.

Totally hooked as are friends. Wakeboard didnt' even get wet this weekend.

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Olive

Looking for suggestions for an 04 VLX (I have the hard internal rear tanks :(

Going out for a week's holidays on Saturday -- half the family is surfing normal, and half goofy -- what are the suggestions for extra sacks and what type of pump is recommended. Kids/wife are using at broadcast 4'9" and I have the 5'6" -- with me (210 in the boat -- kids are ropeless all day) but when I'm surfing the pocket is tight but doable :)

We have no front ballast -- so one there (how big and where to place)

Mid plus rear + plus one sack for my goofy riding (how big -- and placed on the seats?)

Finally -- pumps range from 60-100 dollars -- what is the recommendation?

Thanks for the help!!

Regards, Olive.

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SunDoo
Looking for suggestions for an 04 VLX (I have the hard internal rear tanks :(

Going out for a week's holidays on Saturday -- half the family is surfing normal, and half goofy -- what are the suggestions for extra sacks and what type of pump is recommended. Kids/wife are using at broadcast 4'9" and I have the 5'6" -- with me (210 in the boat -- kids are ropeless all day) but when I'm surfing the pocket is tight but doable :)

We have no front ballast -- so one there (how big and where to place)

Mid plus rear + plus one sack for my goofy riding (how big -- and placed on the seats?)

Finally -- pumps range from 60-100 dollars -- what is the recommendation?

Thanks for the help!!

Regards, Olive.

A little late but here is my setup. Two peeps in bow or hard tank if you have it, full center, full port or starboard depending on rider + 750 lb flyhigh in rear locker.....works wonders for us!! We use the 750 plus wedge at 7 or so and I ride with 2 kids under 7 and my wife driving. Pocket isn't long but still lots of fun....oh yeah, I am 185lbs on a 4'9" Broadcast. Hope it works out this weekend!

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Olive
Looking for suggestions for an 04 VLX (I have the hard internal rear tanks :(

Going out for a week's holidays on Saturday -- half the family is surfing normal, and half goofy -- what are the suggestions for extra sacks and what type of pump is recommended. Kids/wife are using at broadcast 4'9" and I have the 5'6" -- with me (210 in the boat -- kids are ropeless all day) but when I'm surfing the pocket is tight but doable :)

We have no front ballast -- so one there (how big and where to place)

Mid plus rear + plus one sack for my goofy riding (how big -- and placed on the seats?)

Finally -- pumps range from 60-100 dollars -- what is the recommendation?

Thanks for the help!!

Regards, Olive.

A little late but here is my setup. Two peeps in bow or hard tank if you have it, full center, full port or starboard depending on rider + 750 lb flyhigh in rear locker.....works wonders for us!! We use the 750 plus wedge at 7 or so and I ride with 2 kids under 7 and my wife driving. Pocket isn't long but still lots of fun....oh yeah, I am 185lbs on a 4'9" Broadcast. Hope it works out this weekend!

We just came back from a week at Torch Lake -- great time... as long as your on the water by 7 AM -- waves/wind by 11 am drove us back to the "sand bar" -- side note -- new mastercraft "sank" last Saturday -- bow into a breaker and the drive powered "in"... ouch.

Regarding our set up -- we purchased the tusumi (sp) pump and the fly high sack -- 350 lb. I place that in the bow, wedge (manual) and left locker and mid ballast -- everything works just fine! :)

Btw, we evaluate 9-11 mph in 0.3 increments and all said "10" worked the best -- other comments? (my older 380 HH sets at about 2,000 rpm - just purrs along with the OJ 425 prop)... what fun. Biggrin.gif

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