Gas, $3.75 a gallon by Summer Estimated

[Malibudude]

John-

How would you propose that be done without destroying a teetering economy?

Carefully

Care to elaborate?

[JohnDoe]

As J-ro noted, the climb in oil prices is explained not only by demand, but because it is also being used as a hedge during this time of the falling dollar. Stabilizing the dollar without causing major disruption to world markets (and domestic) is diffcult, and must be done carefully. My initail response was to J-ro who said that the price of oil was not Bush's fault. My point is that he does bear, at least some, responsibility for the falling dollar.

The major reason commodities, including oil and especially gold have done so much recently, is because foreign investors are dumping their equity and cash holdings (which are usually in dollars as it is still the world's currency) and buy things with more security and stability (gold, oil). Accordingly, the "supply" of the dollar is high, and it has lost value against all other world currencies. The dollar cannot again rise without it regaining its buying power worldwide. That must be done through careful changes to trade policy, such as strategic trade alliances, similar to triangular arbitrage, but can involve more than 3 economies. I'm not saying become isolationists, but we can't sell ourselves out for the cheapest import. When that occurs, foreign countries are the ones getting rich off of our (previous) spending power. Once those countries then exchange their dollars for hedge commodities, we have truly lost our ability to control our own economy. Look at what the euro has done recently, not only against the dollar, but against many world currencies. That's because they have created a collectively beneficial system where someone within the EU has the same marginal advantage to do/build/create something for value as another country who does not use the euro. Thus the euro is not selling itself short, the inter-european economy is most effective, and collectively, their economies are thriving.

I am not an economist. This may be all rambling incoherent.

[88Skier]

Funny how when gas first went up to $3.00/gal, supply/demand was the reason.

[JohnDoe]

Look what the economy has done since then.

[SCOTTDOMINE]

$4/gal wouldn't be as bad if you were getting 70 mpg.

Coming Soon from VW: A 69.9 MPG Diesel Hybrid

By Chuck Squatriglia February 28, 2008 | 10:04:10 AM

Categories: Diesel, Geneva Motor Show, Hybrids

It's official - Volkswagen is unveiling a hybrid to challenge the mighty Toyota Prius. And not just any hybrid, but a diesel-electric hybrid it says will deliver 69.9 mpg.

VW's been experimenting with hybrids of the gasoline-electric variety since the early 1990s, but the Golf hybrid it will unveil next month at the Geneva Motor Show is the first production model the German company's rolled out. Volkswagen isn't offering much in the way of details, but the car is expected to have a parallel hybrid drivetrain with a 2.0 liter engine. Look for it to have an all-electric mode at low speed, start-stop capability, regenerative braking and a 7-speed DSG double-clutch transmission, according to Auto Express and AutoBlog Green.

What's all the techno-jargon mean? The Golf Hybrid will get almost 70 mph while meeting Europe's stringent Euro V and America's Tier 2 Bin 5 emissions standards, making it green enough even for California. The car is said to emit just 89 g/km of CO2. (For comparison, the Prius emits 104 g/km and Honda Civic Hybrid emits 116.)

The hybrid Golf may be just the start.

According to Britain's Channel 4, VW is considering the hybrid drivetrain in a Jetta and Audi A3. DailyTech says it also could appear in the VW Tiguan and Audi Q5 crossover utility vehicles.

Auto Express says the Golf hybrid will be offered for sale in Europe by the end of next year. No word yet on when we might see it on this side of the pond. { }

That's all fine and dandy, but are we gonna pull our Bu's w/ this thing

[stewart]

Average price for 87 octane in CA is now $3.50/gal.

$3.75 will be here before we know it....

[NorCaliBu]

That's all fine and dandy, but are we gonna pull our Bu's w/ this thing

Obviously not but if I could save some $$ in the daily driver that's more to put in the Swampster.

[Malibudude]

Average price for 87 octane in CA is now $3.50/gal.

$3.75 will be here before we know it....

What do you mean it's already here for you and the thirsty 8.1...

[CTSunsetter]

We won't go any less because of the price of gas. However, because of the increasing price of gas, we will stick with our 1998 Sunsetter another season or more. This leaves us in a comfortable and responsible financial situation where we don't need to make any “sacrifices” and we can keep the boat regardless of our employment status. Sure I'd love to have a spanking new $50K boat out there, but mine is perfectly fine from where it matters the most: the handle end of the rope.

[hyperlitenerd]

Average price for 87 octane in CA is now $3.50/gal.

$3.75 will be here before we know it....

I paid 3.77 for premium for the car gotta stay off the turbos this week...65mph+cruise control.

[stewart]

The best price I saw for diesel on the way home tonight was $3.89, yikes!

[NvBoarder]

Fuel cost won't be the reason I don't go boating every weekend it will be the lack of work!! My weekly income has been cut in half if not more than half. At this point I might be looking for a second job just to afford my bills....

Of course the other option is to charge everything and worry about paying it off when the market picks back up!

[winddawg]

The way it is going now in NorCal we may be looking at $3.75 a gallon as a bargin. I was in Tahoe last week and the pump stopped at $100.00 for the diesel in the truck and it wasn't full, very painful.

We need to start drilling more wells in this country.

[SunriseH2OSkier]

The best price I saw for diesel on the way home tonight was $3.89, yikes!

$3.99 around here.

[NvBoarder]

The best price I saw for diesel on the way home tonight was $3.89, yikes!

$3.99 around here.

I think the reason they get away with such high diesel prices is because it is never discussed in the public eye. Everyone talks about unleaded gas what about diesel? Have you ever seen the cost of diesel talked about on the news, I know I haven't. Diesel should be as low if not lower than regular unleaded, not premium. Rant over

I have seen it in Nevada for $3.56 but I know it will be $4.00 before long.

[Malibudude]

The way it is going now in NorCal we may be looking at $3.75 a gallon as a bargin. I was in Tahoe last week and the pump stopped at $100.00 for the diesel in the truck and it wasn't full, very painful.

We need to start drilling more wells in this country.

Perhaps since we haven’t built a new refinery in 30 years certainly doesn’t help even if there is enough supply of crude.

[jjackkrash]

A guy the from WallStreet Journal the other night on the news said the US actually has an "oversupply" of oil and is, in fact, stockpiling it. He also said real demand was down. His explaination for the higher price of gas was the weak dollar and investors buying oil as a hedge against the dollar. Its all B.S., imo. Exxon/Mobil is quite content to make $40B quarterly profits, not develop any new refineries, and stick us all in the a-hole.

[MalibuTime]

The way it is going now in NorCal we may be looking at $3.75 a gallon as a bargin. I was in Tahoe last week and the pump stopped at $100.00 for the diesel in the truck and it wasn't full, very painful.

We need to start drilling more wells in this country.

Perhaps since we haven’t built a new refinery in 30 years certainly doesn’t help even if there is enough supply of crude.

C&D has an interesting editorial, basically that refineries in the US produce 50% gas, 15% diesel and 35% other (asphalt,jet fuel, home heating oil etc) out of each barrel of oil, and that is the ratio for each refinery because of the way they are engineered here.

Europe, and most of the rest of the world is about 50-50 on gas/diesel split out of a barrel (25% gas, 25% diesel 50% other). Europe actually exports refined gasoline to the US because they are a diesel oriented consumer. The whole point, as more diesels hit the roads, price in US is going to keep getting worse over gas until you start seeing refinery capacity increased.

I think the way to go for big tow rigs is going to be gas/electric hybrids.

87 is about 3.43 here, 89 3.53+

Edited March 7, 2008 by TheBlackPearl

[stewart]

that makes sense to me.

[JohnDoe]

A guy the from WallStreet Journal the other night on the news said the US actually has an "oversupply" of oil and is, in fact, stockpiling it. He also said real demand was down. His explaination for the higher price of gas was the weak dollar and investors buying oil as a hedge against the dollar. Its all B.S., imo. Exxon/Mobil is quite content to make $40B quarterly profits, not develop any new refineries, and stick us all in the a-hole.

Please see post 78...WSJ guy is correct.

I'm tired of people blaming the EPA for there not being more refineries. Oil companies have zero incentive to do so, it's just business management. As for drilling more in US, thats doesn't solve anything, all it does it contribute a "drop in the bucket" to the worlds oil supply, and will be sold to the highest bidder. The marginal increase in our ability to produce crude and the very low impact it would have on prices is not worth it. Not to mention, whatever oil we start producing, OPEC will just cut supply by that amount which will keep prices the same anyway.

[Guest J-Ro]

The C&D article basically dumbs down the concept of crack spread. The reason it is done in those quantities is because it is the most efficient use of a barrel of oil and yields the most profit for the US consumers.

Diesel is a little stickier. The fact that it was always so cheap compared to unleaded was the lack of demand for that percentage of the crack. Now we rely very heavily on commercial diesel use and heating/energy products which remove the supply of diesel and diesel derivatives. Thus increasing the price of diesel because the crack percentage hasn't been adjusted. Therefore your diesel is more expensive. If we move to more diesel consumption, the crack percentages will change and diesel will again come beck in line with the other products.

The average Joe could get a great lesson in macro economics if they would research oil and it's pricing instead of just blaming Bush while he shoves his 20% interest credit card into the pump and fills the 40 gallon tank in his F450 that he needs because he brings home a 2x4 once a year.

[mainekneeboarder]

This whole fuel/gasoline issue is rediculas, and there isnt anything we can do to stop it! The oil companies are raping us on cost PERIOD! Its not supply and demand, or to little refineries or any other story some one can come up with. And anyone that really thinks these Hybird vihicles is going to help needs a reallity check! Do you think the oil companies are going to let low sale numbers from more of these cars being built and driven affect thier profit numbers? NO, they will just keep jacking us up the A$$ by raising the price per gallon to make up for it and keep their profits high! Their profits have tripled and quaddrupled over the last few years, do you really think they are going to let their profits drop? The goverment needs to step in and do somthing about it or its just going to get worse. But most of the people invovled in the goverment is in oil and making money from it, so why step in? If any small buisness man out there was to tripple his profits in a few years time by just raising his/her prices on items, they would be under investigation from someone quickly, and somthing would be done about it.

I recently went through something similar with my insurance company. I had gotten into and accendent and taken my truck to get a quate at a local shop. the insurance company sent thier adjuster down to look at it. They then sent me the damage report and said I could take it anyplace I wanted but they only pay $40.00 an hour! The shop I got my quate from charges $45.00. I told them this and they still said they only pay $40.00 and hour. I said well I should be able to chose what I pay for insurance then, right? The insurance company's are regulating what the body shop can charge?

If the insurance companies can do this, because they think body shops are making too much off of them, then why can't something be done about the oil companies profit going up every quarter? Because anyone that has stock in oil makes money when profit goes up! I mean come on, $40 billion dollar quarterly PROFIT! Isn't that a bit much. And people think the oil companies are just gonna sit back and start loosing profit money when these high MPG cars come out. I DON'T THINK SO. Any of us that like the comfort and security of a big vehicle, and likes to do more then work and go home, is going to pay for it when the price per gallon keeps going up!

Sorry for the rant, but everything revolves around fuel prices, and something really does need to happen soon!

No, higher gas prices probably won't affect how much I use the boat, it may affect how much time I spend in the shop making money though! which in turn makes spending money on gas so I can spend time with my family at the pond that much easier!

PS, this post is not directed at anyone in this thread.

Edited March 7, 2008 by mainekneeboarder

[JohnDoe]

The average Joe could get a great lesson in macro economics if they would research oil and it's pricing instead of just blaming Bush while he shoves his 20% interest credit card into the pump and fills the 40 gallon tank in his F450 that he needs because he brings home a 2x4 once a year.

"Blaming Bush" is just too easy, though

I agree he has little direct impact on oil pricing, supply, and demand, however, his policies have contributed to the price of oil to the average citizen.

[JohnDoe]

Maine, passionate rant, I like it. However, commodities and futures traders, as well as foreign governments, have played a large part in "manipulating" the price of a barrel of oil which is actually much different than what the markets actually pay.

[NvBoarder]

The C&D article basically dumbs down the concept of crack spread. The reason it is done in those quantities is because it is the most efficient use of a barrel of oil and yields the most profit for the US consumers.

Diesel is a little stickier. The fact that it was always so cheap compared to unleaded was the lack of demand for that percentage of the crack. Now we rely very heavily on commercial diesel use and heating/energy products which remove the supply of diesel and diesel derivatives. Thus increasing the price of diesel because the crack percentage hasn't been adjusted. Therefore your diesel is more expensive. If we move to more diesel consumption, the crack percentages will change and diesel will again come beck in line with the other products.

The average Joe could get a great lesson in macro economics if they would research oil and it's pricing instead of just blaming Bush while he shoves his 20% interest credit card into the pump and fills the 40 gallon tank in his F450 that he needs because he brings home a 2x4 once a year.

If I could ride my bicycle to work and only drive the truck when I towed the boat I would be all over that and wouldn't b****, unfortunately I can't carry all my tools for work on my back. So I guess I will keep Bi@ching.

I'm waiting for the day all the independent truckers pull off the road and call the bank and say your trucks sitting on I80 @ mile marker so and so, I quit.