Is this normal?

[WakeGirl]

Give David or Gary a call over at Madras. Their old service manager knew all about HDS & how to fix it back when we thought that we might have that problem with the yellow boat (turned out to be a leaky plug) - his name was Randy, but he doesn't work for them anymore. But still, I'd be a little surprised if Gary doesn't know about HDS leaks & how to fix them. Basically as it was described to me, you just let the hull dry out really well (maybe helping it out a little), grind out the existing glue/sealer, clean it all out really good & then reseal it. I can't imagine it being a fun job, but it can't be all that hard or technically challenging to do. I think that I can find out where Randy's working if that turns out to be a dead end, so keep me posted.

[jetskipro550]

Thanks, I will give them a call in the AM

[oldfooter]

Sounds like trouble if you ask me.

Does your boat freeze in the winter?

Want me to drill a hole in my hull and see if I get any water out? j/k I don't have a lined bildge.

The boat is kept in a garage, but it does get below freezing from time to time throughout the winter months.

That does not sound right at all, I know you mention only being in about 1/8-1/4 but if you didn't go all the way through there is now way there should be water in between the bottom and inside of the hull. You may want to pull anything that goes through the bottom into the hull and make sure there is now separation.

What year is the boat your working on?

The boat is a 1999 Sunsetter LXi. Thinking about it more, I didn't go any further then 1/4" because I was using a hole saw bit and the "teeth" on the saw had just began to scratch the gel coat and the bit is only 1/4 above the saw teeth. We haven't had any problems with water coming into the boat and there are no bubbles or imperfections in the fiberglass.

Well, the good thing is it has warranty at least the hull should. As the OP said, if it has separated from hard impacts you need to report this and maybe you'll be getting a new hull

Even though we aren't the original owners?

Well, that I'm not sure about. Someone else who knows more about this will chime in i'm sure, but when I bought mine, they said the hull is life time as long as it doesn't show abuse. When we talked about the extended warranty they said it is tranferable, but that only applied to the normal stuff that isn't covered after the three years. I would call Malibu direct and find out what is going on, make sure to have everything in writing for your protection. Do not except any verbals from anyone learned that the hard way years ago.

As far as the hull warranty issue goes, I purchased my 2004 XTi in April of this year. The hull was warrantied to the original owner, but I had it transferred to my name. In order to do so, I had to have a marine inspection done by an approved Malibu dealer. I had Waterski America in Dallas do this as they were the original dealer for the boat and had all the maintenance records. I think the inspection was about $150. They (Waterski America) then fill out a "Malibu Boats Transferable Lifetime Limited Warranty Transfer Request" I think they sent this form to Malibu Boats Warranty Department in California or Tennessee along with another $500 of my hard earned money!!! This had to be done within 10 days of purchase of the boat). For warranty questions you can call Malibu Boats Warranty Department in California or Tennessee at (209) 383-7469 or (865) 458-5475.

I hope this helps you. If not you, perhaps someone that is looking at buying a used BU may use this information. Now that I am reading this thread, I am glad that I did spend the extra money.

[doughickey]

Yes, this was discussed several months ago. (In fact, I recall Skicrave had investigated even years earlier.)

General consensus (although I found it hard to believe then.... and still do) was that this was "normal". What? Whatever water is creeping its way in will freeze in the winter and expand 10%.... and make whatever gap that already exists even bigger. That's why we have so many potholes in the road in the northern part of our continent. (Yes, that's not just Canada.... it includes the northern US also.) Small cracks let water in.... expands... and voila, you get a pothole.

If this water thing is "normal", I guess you could say, we're all growing "potholes" in our Malibus. Not a good thing.

Does dad know you're drilling holes in the boat? (Sorry.... couldn't resist.)

[jetskipro550]

What was discussed earlier was water sitting between the hull and the bilge liner. This is between layers of the hull, NOT the liner and the hull. I understand the liner issue, but this seems more serious since the bilge liner doesn't offer any (or hardly any) structural support.

[doughickey]

You're right that water between layers of fibreglass is worse than water between liner and hull. But, either way, trapped water in the winter means trouble.

I agree that your concern needs someone in the know to respond.

Although 3 gallons is under 25 pounds, it still is a volume of over 600 cubic inches. If you assume even a 1/4" gap, this means you are covering an area of 2658 square inches or 18 square feet. I can't imagine having a gap as large as 1/4"..... I suspect it is a larger pocket. Besides, if water was evenly spread out over 18 square feet in a gap only 1/4".... it would take a while to drain out.... not come gushing out all at once. I suspect a more concentrated volume.

..... still alarming.

[WakeGirl]

I'm gonna bet HDS, BICBW on that. If that's the case, you're going to need to dry that hull out really good which means pulling that plug/fitting out & getting all of that water out of there before you even consider a repair. There have been a couple of other threads on it, so search around & you'll find them (there's one currently running).

Warranty probably doesn't apply here because your dad isn't the original owner & neither is the guy you bought it from.

[oldfooter]

Just to be sure that it's not something really obvious, I might pop the lid on the HDS & look for any obvious signs. Leaks from HDS boxes can show up as far forward as in the ski locker, so the proximity doesn't necessarily rule it out.

Call me stupid....but I am new at this....what is the HDS?

[LS-One]

I am confident in the hole that I drilled and the intake that I installed...its the rest of the hull that has me worried now.

Me too ! I'd be drilling more holes.

[LS-One]

Just to be sure that it's not something really obvious, I might pop the lid on the HDS & look for any obvious signs. Leaks from HDS boxes can show up as far forward as in the ski locker, so the proximity doesn't necessarily rule it out.

Call me stupid....but I am new at this....what is the HDS?

Hydronic dampening system. Fancy words for building a box around the point where the shaft goes through the hull and flooding it with water to absorb any shaft vibration. Works well though.

[WakeGirl]

Just to be sure that it's not something really obvious, I might pop the lid on the HDS & look for any obvious signs. Leaks from HDS boxes can show up as far forward as in the ski locker, so the proximity doesn't necessarily rule it out.

Call me stupid....but I am new at this....what is the HDS?

Hydronic dampening system. Fancy words for building a box around the point where the shaft goes through the hull and flooding it with water to absorb any shaft vibration. Works well though.

A hotly debated point. If only Ruta could see this one.

[LS-One]

Just to be sure that it's not something really obvious, I might pop the lid on the HDS & look for any obvious signs. Leaks from HDS boxes can show up as far forward as in the ski locker, so the proximity doesn't necessarily rule it out.

Call me stupid....but I am new at this....what is the HDS?

Hydronic dampening system. Fancy words for building a box around the point where the shaft goes through the hull and flooding it with water to absorb any shaft vibration. Works well though.

A hotly debated point. If only Ruta could see this one.

OK I take it back... I heard it works well. But, the person who told me was sitting on a bus bench on the shady side of Las Vegas with a gallon jug of Vin Rose between his legs... Honest.

Edited June 27, 2007 by LS-One

[WakeGirl]

(whether it's true or not)

[doughickey]

Dampening?

Interesting using "water" to dampen sound.

If I recall from early science class..... and later in Vibration Theory..... water TRANSMITS vibrations very well. That's why when you put your head underwater, you can hear the spin of a propeller from a boat far far away.... sometimes you can barely see the boat with your eyes..... yet you can hear the spinning prop. Vibrations (and sound is one form of vibration) travels VERY quickly through water.... much faster than in air. So fast that your head ( a microprocesser) can NOT determine the time differential between your left ear and your right ear in order to determine the direction of the sound. You can hear the prop, but can't deterine the direction/source.

Then there's "water-hammer" in our home's water pipes. Turn a tap on full, then slam it shut real fast. Or have a dishwasher that closes a valve really quickly...... it causes "water-hammer".... a VERY quick and violant vibration that sounds like a bang, and can destroy a copper pipe connection. Water transmits this vibration all along the length of the pipe.

So..... HDS may have a bit of a flaw in the design concept.

[Tom Sawyer]

So..... HDS may have a bit of a flaw in the design concept.

Now that you mention it, I think it might have even more than one.

[jetskipro550]

Not an HDS problem, I am thinking it was more of a problem with a bad seal on some underwater gear. Last summer we had the rudder, shaft, strut, prop, wedge, replaced and after further inspection it seems that parts of the strut and rudder didn't get sealed all the way around. I re-sealed them with 3M 5200 Marine sealant, took it down to the water, came home, pulled out the thru-hull I installed, checked for any water...and nothing Cleaned it all up and re-installed the thru-hull, hooked up my pumps and now my ballast system is working flawlessly too

[D-GOOSE]

good to hear it all turned out ok.

[WakeGirl]

Good deal!

[skicrave]

Glad there was a happy resolution to the situation.

[doughickey]

Not an HDS problem, I am thinking it was more of a problem with a bad seal on some underwater gear. Last summer we had the rudder, shaft, strut, prop, wedge, replaced and after further inspection it seems that parts of the strut and rudder didn't get sealed all the way around. I re-sealed them with 3M 5200 Marine sealant, took it down to the water, came home, pulled out the thru-hull I installed, checked for any water...and nothing Cleaned it all up and re-installed the thru-hull, hooked up my pumps and now my ballast system is working flawlessly too

Glad the problem appears to have been fixed. However, a few questions:

Your original post suggested the water came out before you had completely drilled through the hull. Sounded like it was trapped between layers the way you described it. Have you fully determined the water was in fact between the layers? Did it sit there over the winter... and freeze.

Also... just curious. I can't recall the reason why the strut et al needed replacing (sounds like an underwater collision).... so, who did the repair and didn't quite get the sealing done properly? Are they taking any responisibility for the new fix? And any possible other damage?

[jetskipro550]

Not an HDS problem, I am thinking it was more of a problem with a bad seal on some underwater gear. Last summer we had the rudder, shaft, strut, prop, wedge, replaced and after further inspection it seems that parts of the strut and rudder didn't get sealed all the way around. I re-sealed them with 3M 5200 Marine sealant, took it down to the water, came home, pulled out the thru-hull I installed, checked for any water...and nothing Cleaned it all up and re-installed the thru-hull, hooked up my pumps and now my ballast system is working flawlessly too

Glad the problem appears to have been fixed. However, a few questions:

Your original post suggested the water came out before you had completely drilled through the hull. Sounded like it was trapped between layers the way you described it. Have you fully determined the water was in fact between the layers? Did it sit there over the winter... and freeze.

It might have, although it was in sealed garage so I doubt it..but I have no way of knowing really. All I know is that our garage (about 15 minutes away) which has a "doggy door" (which makes it colder) never got below freezing last winter.

Also... just curious. I can't recall the reason why the strut et al needed replacing (sounds like an underwater collision).... so, who did the repair and didn't quite get the sealing done properly? Are they taking any responisibility for the new fix? And any possible other damage?

Yeah we had a nice run in with a submerged log last summer New wedge, prop, rudder, strut, shaft...All work was done by a local mechanic and not by Malibu. I don't fully blame him, mainly because he was working his butt off to get our boat done in time for my parents HB trip. So it might have just been one of those things where he got busy or distracted and didn't get finished. He didn't even get a chance to water test it all, cause we were down at his shop (standing there) waiting for it to get finished.

Edited July 17, 2007 by jetskipro550