2017 LSV 23 - Wetsounds Stereo

[IXFE]

9 minutes ago, shawndoggy said:

While that's a good start (I mean the enclosure should always be sized to the driver, right?), to me the bigger question is the construction of the box.  Through 2016 Malibu has used the jankiest of janky construction methods.... just HDPE and staples, with no effort to truly seal the box.  The cheapest of the cheap mdf online sub boxes are better built (albeit NOT out of waterproof materials).

We're not gonna know the answer to this piece of the equation until

1) somebody takes one apart, or

2) somebody gets a pic while on the factory tour

when I was at the factory in May we walked through the area where they were "building" sub enclosures. I pointed out to our tour guide the flaws in the boxes. It wasn't hard to do... there were soooo many visible gaps in the pile of boxes we were looking at. When I was done showing him these gaps and explaining why it's a problem, the tour guide just stared at me dumbfounded.  I actually felt bad that I put him in that position. I decided to STFU and didn't register another complaint the rest of the day. Lol

[BadgerBoater55]

1 hour ago, IXFE said:

When I was at the factory in May we walked through the area where they were "building" sub enclosures. I pointed out to our tour guide the flaws in the boxes. It wasn't hard to do... there were soooo many visible gaps in the pile of boxes we were looking at. When I was done showing him these gaps and explaining why it's a problem, the tour guide just stared at me dumbfounded.  I actually felt bad that I put him in that position. I decided to STFU and didn't register another complaint the rest of the day. Lol

While I would feel awkward in that situation, I think it is perfectly fine.  For a guy as passionate about the brand and industry as you are, well, they should be warned prior to the tour. 

All joking aside, it will be interesting to see how this plays out.  I understand a lot of people see the "picky" part of your posts as off putting or just overkill, but when paying this amount of $$$ for a boat it should be a turnkey experience and not some shoddy work.

[ibelonginprison]

They should be warned that they're giving a tour to a guy that buys a brand new boat every... single... season. 

lol 

 

Dave - how 'bout them breaktime sammiches?

Edited August 30, 2016 by ibelonginprison

[IXFE]

12 minutes ago, BadgerBoater55 said:

While I would feel awkward in that situation, I think it is perfectly fine.  For a guy as passionate about the brand and industry as you are, well, they should be warned prior to the tour. 

All joking aside, it will be interesting to see how this plays out.  I understand a lot of people see the "picky" part of your posts as off putting or just overkill, but when paying this amount of $$$ for a boat it should be a turnkey experience and not some shoddy work.

Somebody gets me!!  Ahhh... feels good!  

Thanks Badger 

[ibelonginprison]

30 minutes ago, BadgerBoater55 said:

While I would feel awkward in that situation, I think it is perfectly fine.  For a guy as passionate about the brand and industry as you are, well, they should be warned prior to the tour. 

All joking aside, it will be interesting to see how this plays out.  I understand a lot of people see the "picky" part of your posts as off putting or just overkill, but when paying this amount of $$$ for a boat EVERY SINGLE YEAR it should be a turnkey experience and not some shoddy work.

 

Fixed that for ya... 

[wetsounds1]

Hi guys,

Let me clarify some information on the new system.  The new system was designed by us and the engineers at Malibu to provide the highest performing factory system and one that rivals most aftermarket systems.  This system was designed for power and output and sound quality and there were no shortcuts in regards to the design.  They are also tuned to optimum and not under tuned.

Components are: Malibu specific amplifiers based on the brand new SYN DX DSP amps.  These are all DSP controlled and tuned by us.  Each amplifier has specific tunes.  These tunes give us the ability to adjust for speaker placement, frequency, crossovers, time alignment and gain.  They are tuned for optimum output and sound quality.  The models are the 6ch and 2ch.  The 6 ch has 125x4 and 150x2 at 4 ohms.  Running the system with 4 pairs of in boats, the amplifier produces 200x4 at 2 ohms so 100 watts per speaker.  It also bridges for 600x1 on the subwoofer.  So you can see it is a ton more power then previous years. The 2 ch is 200x2 at 4 ohms and 375x2 at 2 ohms.  So 187.5 per tower when running 2 pairs.  Optimum for the REV 8 or ICON 8 based Malibu specific tower speakers.  

Speakers are NOT XS-650 or XS-808.  The speakers are based on our brand new REVO series of interior speakers and subwoofers.  The 6.5 and 8" inch are an all new ground up design with new frame, new motor structure, new voice coil venting, new integrated 12dB crossover, integrated wire leads, new composites.  And new voicing for a smooth response while still maintaining output.  Subwoofer is a 12" high powered sub that is based on the XS-12.  All proprietary grilles have a brushed aluminum overlay to match the tower speakers.

The subwoofer enclosures are using king starlight xl composite material that is a replacement material for MDF.  They are all CNC cut and screwed and glued.  The enclosures are solid now and work great.  

Head unit is a design we worked with Malibu and Medallion on.  Medallion is providing the unit with their control system for a more integrated system.  we worked with them on the zone and volume controls and GUI.  

The amplifiers all have waterproof connector plugs for input for source and speaker outputs. The head unit box has waterproof plugs on the output to direct plug into the amplifers. This you will see is just like automotive OEM system.  Both in the pre tuned DSP profiles as well as the connectors.  OEM automotive have been doing proprietary connectors for years.  To add to a system, there are companies that make adapters.  I see the same here for those that wish to add to a system.  So I would not worry about upgrade opportunities.

We will have a dealer network that are Wet Sounds authorized DSP.  So these dealers will have ability to work on the system and upgrade and add to it.

Everyone who has heard the system has been blown away and we have heard comments like "night and day" improvement, amazing, sounds awesome and so on.  So give the new systems a look and listen.  

Tim

Wet Sounds

[teamerickson]

^^ Whoa!

[shadetreefab]

Didn't see that coming

[BadgerBoater55]

1 hour ago, shadetreefab said:

Didn't see that coming

It is what the CREW is all about!  But I have to agree didn't see that much detail coming.

[wetsounds1]

Also, just confirmed the enclosure material thickness is 3/4".  CNC cut and screwed with 3"- #10 screws every 3 inches.  Silicone will not stick to it but as the material is CNC cut and 

malleable, it is sealed.  These are nothing like previous years.  Also, with the DSP tunes.  We tune the subwoofer to have a good solid amount of bass and stay tight without rattles.

Trust me.  These boats sound awesome and unless your a guy going to do multiple subs with serious power and 6 REV 10's on the tower.  This system is perfect for the majority.  

Let me know anything else I can answer.

Tim

Wet Sounds

[mrnate450r]

@wetsounds1, is the amp for the tower speakers enough to power a pair of Rev 10's? Also, your next order of business should be to get Malibu to order your tower speaker mounts instead of the hideous shelves they currently use. 

[teamerickson]

@wetsounds1Enclosure volume?

Edited August 31, 2016 by teamerickson

[SimonWS]

The enclosure volume varies by model and style of boat.  The traditional bow, MXZ, and M235 are 3 different enclosures.  They range from 1.1 to 1.25 cuft, which is the ideal sealed volume for the XS-12.

21 VLX is mounted free air, but with the DSP we are able to EQ the subwoofer to reproduce very accurate bass!  The feedback on the bass response has been great!

 

Simon

Wet Sounds

[shawndoggy]

5 hours ago, mrnate450r said:

@wetsounds1, is the amp for the tower speakers enough to power a pair of Rev 10's? Also, your next order of business should be to get Malibu to order your tower speaker mounts instead of the hideous shelves they currently use. 

These are two VERY good points.  

Regarding switching to Rev10s, @wetsounds1 says "We will have a dealer network that are Wet Sounds authorized DSP.  So these dealers will have ability to work on the system and upgrade and add to it."  

Maybe @SimonWS knows -- Should we read this to say (1) "you can haul your boat to a stereo shop to have them re-do your tower speakers and amps," or (2) "this is something your malibu dealer can switch out on a plug and play basis and we will have pre-configured tunes for a reasonable number of potential upgrade paths that your Malibu dealer can load"?  I know that being able to go to Rev10s and to a bigger sub (say WS XXX or equivalent) is a big deal to frequent buyers.

Edited September 1, 2016 by shawndoggy

[23LSVOwner]

20 hours ago, wetsounds1 said:

Hi guys,

Let me clarify some information on the new system. 

Speakers are NOT XS-650 or XS-808.  The speakers are based on our brand new REVO series of interior speakers and subwoofers.  The 6.5 and 8" inch are an all new ground up design with new frame, new motor structure, new voice coil venting, new integrated 12dB crossover, integrated wire leads, new composites.  And new voicing for a smooth response while still maintaining output.  Subwoofer is a 12" high powered sub that is based on the XS-12.  All proprietary grilles have a brushed aluminum overlay to match the tower speakers.

 

Tim

Wet Sounds

Might want to fix the your part numbers provided to Malibu. My friend saw those referenced in them.

[shawndoggy]

@wetsounds1 and @SimonWS for some reason the tags aren't working in my prior post.

also where does the revo series sit vis a vis the XS series?

[shawndoggy]

allo?  Wetsounds?  You guys still there?

[IXFE]

[wetsounds1]

On August 31, 2016 at 2:04 PM, mrnate450r said:

@wetsounds1, is the amp for the tower speakers enough to power a pair of Rev 10's? Also, your next order of business should be to get Malibu to order your tower speaker mounts instead of the hideous shelves they currently use. 

To answer the REV 10 question.  A SYN DX2 can power a pair.  It is not optimum power as the REV like 300-400 watts per speaker and it would be 200 watts, surfing it would be fine.  So really to jump to REV 10 for the fullest level of their ability, it would be good to step to a SD-2.  As for the shelfs.  We are working on some options. 

 

On September 1, 2016 at 7:12 PM, shawndoggy said:

These are two VERY good points.  

Regarding switching to Rev10s, @wetsounds1 says "We will have a dealer network that are Wet Sounds authorized DSP.  So these dealers will have ability to work on the system and upgrade and add to it."  

Maybe @SimonWS knows -- Should we read this to say (1) "you can haul your boat to a stereo shop to have them re-do your tower speakers and amps," or (2) "this is something your malibu dealer can switch out on a plug and play basis and we will have pre-configured tunes for a reasonable number of potential upgrade paths that your Malibu dealer can load"?  I know that being able to go to Rev10s and to a bigger sub (say WS XXX or equivalent) is a big deal to frequent buyers.

  I would say your right on both points.  With number 2 being a longer term goal.

 

On September 1, 2016 at 7:01 AM, 23LSVOwner said:

Might want to fix the your part numbers provided to Malibu. My friend saw those referenced in them.

Thanks, we have notified them of this

 

16 hours ago, shawndoggy said:

@wetsounds1 and @SimonWS for some reason the tags aren't working in my prior post.

also where does the revo series sit vis a vis the XS series?

REVO Series is above the XS.  These are IMHO, the best built and best sounding marine speakers anywhere.  We have worked for a long time to build a speaker that plays loud but sounds amazing.  Normally when designing a speaker, you either lean towards output or towards sound quality.  We have always tried to find the balance of output and sound quality and I don't think there is anyone else that can do it how we do it and provide both.  With the REVO, we have amazing sound quality and amazing output.  And the speaker is a ground up design so there is no shard parts with anything in our line.  New frames with new VC venting for 30% improvement in cooling, new motor structure, no crossovers integrated into the frames, new materials, new grille options, new twist and lock tweeters, 

 

Sorry it takes me a while to find the time to get on here and answers.  So feel free to keep them coming but might take me some time as we are running crazy as you can imagine.

 

Tim

Wet Sounds

[shawndoggy]

@wetsounds1 so you are saying for rev 10s, properly powered, that you'd basically have to go "old school" and bypass the DSP stuff to make it work?  And that right now you don't have a dsp amp that's plug-n-play that will power rev10s?  And that there are no active plans to roll out upgrade paths to malibu dealers?  (it would be nice to do sometime, but you aren't planning on rolling out in Q1 of 2017 or whatever).  

Basically new stereo is what it is, you get what you get.  If you wanna upgrade it, you pay the premium for the stereo on the frontend and then spend more money on upgrades.  I mean there really isn't going to be a market for a used DSP amp is there, since consumers can't retune them (and won't have the proprietary wiring harness in the first instance)?

Seems like the takeaways here are (1) much improved stereo that should satisfy many more people than in years past, and (2) discriminating buyers better make darn sure they are happy with every aspect of the stereo because upgrades are going to basically require throwing expensive parts away.

On 8/31/2016 at 11:42 AM, wetsounds1 said:

Also, just confirmed the enclosure material thickness is 3/4".  CNC cut and screwed with 3"- #10 screws every 3 inches.  Silicone will not stick to it but as the material is CNC cut and 

malleable, it is sealed.  These are nothing like previous years.  Also, with the DSP tunes.  We tune the subwoofer to have a good solid amount of bass and stay tight without rattles.

Trust me.  These boats sound awesome and unless your a guy going to do multiple subs with serious power and 6 REV 10's on the tower.  This system is perfect for the majority.  

Let me know anything else I can answer.

Tim

Wet Sounds

Tim, as you know, David, formerly of earmark, pontificates about all things stereo (and is a big WS fan).  I knew I remember reading him saying that there are concerns using starboard for sub boxes.  I used the google machine and found plenty of (wordy!) posts from david about how starboard is a bad material because there are no adhesives to bond it.  Will you guys be cnc'ing some fancy joints to address this?  I mean CNC'd mdf plus screws.... nobody would ever advocate not gluing that.  So just because adhesives don't stick to starboard doesn't make adhesives unnecessary in construction does it?  What am I missing here (other than that malibu has a cnc machine and a big pile of starboard to get through)?

[wetsounds1]

No thats NOT what I am saying at all. There is DSP amps for REV 10.  There is plans.  We have not trained all the reps and dealers yet so you have to give it some time and things will make more sense. Be patient.

The enclosures are using the Starlite XL and it is a replacement for MDF.  Malibu is building it. They are CNC cut.  Correct silicone won't stick to it.  But in the end.  Does it matter?  NO.  They are solid.  They are sealed.  The boats rock.  They boats have more bass than any the previous ones.  

At the end of the day, the truth is on the water and hearing is believing. Both are companies slogans make a lot of sense.  Go listen to them.  Take a look at the boats.  Don't get caught up to much of the other stuff.  Its done right and sounds great.

Tim

Wet Sounds

[IXFE]

I was at AWS the other day and sampled the new system with @UpperleftWake (I'll post my complete thoughts and pics a bit later), but one thing we both agreed to was that an upgrade to a single pair of Rev10's would be PERFECT, especially on a G4 boat where you can't for two pair anyway and a single pair helps a ton with head clearance.  

Anyway, I went away from the demo thinking the Rev10 upgrade would be a no brainer... Just pay Malibu for the DSP tower amp w/out tower speakers (assuming that's still a standalone option as in the past). That way you maintain factory integration and can source the Rev10's elsewhere. What I'm reading here is that is not really possible, assuming you want the 10's getting 300+ watts each. 

No clear upgrade path to even a single pair of Rev10's makes this a no go for me in 2017. 

Honestly, this is very disappointing. We're talking about $150k boats in some cases.  It's bad enough that Rev10's aren't a factory option (or that the G4 wasn't originally spec'd for two pair), but to completely overlook this a viable upgrade path seems like a missed opportunity to me. 

Edit: I wrote this before seeing Tims's response.  After reading it I'm still I'm still not sure what the path to Rev10's looks like. The problem with "being patient" is some of us are already putting together our 2017 orders and the choice between this system and "stereo delete" is one of the biggest decisions I face. 

Edited September 2, 2016 by IXFE

[wetsounds1]

There is a lot in the works. Currently the upgrade to a single pair of REV 10 would be adding a a regular amp and pair of speakers with a adapter that is waterproof plug to RCA. Not a big deal and besides the adapter, no different than years past. The DSP is built into each amp. Your not bypassing anything. Next they could do an adapter and use the Wet Sounds DSP version of the amp like the SYN DX4DSP bridging it to 400x2 and have DSP. There is options. Lots of this is very new. That's what I am saying. So new that our site isn't updated yet and a lot of dealers are not trained yet. 

 

Tim

Wet Sounds

[Stevo]

17 minutes ago, wetsounds1 said:

 

At the end of the day, the truth is on the water and hearing is believing. 

Tim

Wet Sounds

[teamerickson]

Great stuff this morning! I haven't even finished my coffee yet!