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Car Stereo advice needed


jwl019

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Just bought a new-to-me 2010 Toyota Tundra TSS Crewmax 4wd, the stereo system (non JBL) is terrible and I don't know anything about stereos. I am coming from an 06 Tundra Limited with JBL system and a 10" stealth box which was in it when I bought the truck.

I need to know what can I replace the stock speakers with and not break the bank. I want to keep the stock radio/cd player because I am not a fan of the look of trim pieces that go around a new one to cover up all the extra space.

Today I picked this up that I found on craigslist along with a set of Husky Liners floor mats for front and back:

JBL GTO-1001EZ 1-Channel amp

Max current draw 95A, Peak power 1450w

Frequency Response 10Hz-280hz

MS-10SD2 SLIM shallow mount sub- Two total

Power Handling (RMS) 500W, Power Handling (Peak) 1000W, Peak Power 1000W, Frequency Response 34Hz-800Hz, Sensitivity (1 W @ 1m) 86dB SPL, Normal Impedance 2+2 ohms

Audio Enhancers sub box custom fit for Crewmax

GTO-RBC Remote Base control

Everything above for $300

So I think I have the bass covered hopefully, don't know what any of those numbers above means, I just copied them from the add. What do I need to improve the mids and highs (speaker brands/sizes, amps, crossovers, etc)?

I don't want to walk in my local stereo shop until I have an idea of what I really need. I am not trying to vibrate my truck, rattle windows, or win a competition but I at least want to hear the radio/cd/ipod when I turn the volume up a little.

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Concentrate your money on the front speakers and an amp for them. Even if it leaves new rear speakers out of the equation. I'll use Boston as an example even though they don't do car anymore. I'd rather have their $600 Pro components in the front and stock rears than splitting that money on their $300 Rally components front and rear. I sit in the front, my ears are in the front, the speakers are leaps and bounds better, so that's where my money goes.

Take your own music, listen to all the component speakers on the board. As you do, realize that your ears become attuned to what you hear first, meaning as you switch it's the differences that will jump out at you. Don't be afraid to switch back and forth between your favorites a few times. I never had a problem showing a customer how to run the board and leaving them alone for a while, hopefully your shop is similar.

What brands does the shop(s) you are going to carry?

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I am actually not sure what they carry since it's been several years since I stepped foot in one to even look. I have never been one who does a lot of customizing to my vehicles other than tint the rear windows in the cab section of a crew cab truck (got to strip the tint on the front side windows in this one since OK laws must be different than LA laws).

Just looking online at our 2 shops I saw JL, Pioneer, Alpine, Kenwood and that's all that I remember off the top of my head.

Spending the money on the front definitely makes since, especially since when the kids are with me the volume is almost off anyway so no one will really care in the back seat.

Just browsing online at Crutchfield there are a couple types of speakers in the same size, coaxial and component. What is the difference and which is better? I think my fronts are 6x9 and the back is 6ish round just guessing due to shspes of the door grills. I also have 3 grills on the dash, one on each end and a pretty good size one in the middle but I can't hear anything playing from the one in the middle so it may just be for looks.

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Component sets will be the higher end, having better crossover networks and separate drivers. Put a 6.5 in the door and the tweeter in the dash. It'll help raise the front sound stage and sound more lively.

I don't know much about Kenwood, but entry level check out the Pioneer components, Alpine Type S, or the JL TR series. not bad in the ~200 range.

Step up to mid level with Alpine Type R or JL C2 around ~300 and you'll get a bit more clarity and power handling.

From there the sky is the limit price wise and it'll be up to you if your ears think it's worth it. I have the JL C5 in my wife's SUV and have been happy with them in that 500 price range. In my other cars I run some old school a/d/s/ stuff that doesn't really apply anymore.

After picking your speakers I recommend looking at a same-brand amp to match. It's what they use for designing and testing their own speakers, so it makes sense to match them up.

Here's some info on your truck and what fits:

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-i4AuGg6DYkH/learn/2007-up-toyota-tundra-doublecab.html

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Here is a strong recommendation for the front speakers....the JL Audio C3-650 separate component set. And here is the reason why.

First, they are great sounding speakers that are very neutral and accurate with an excellent soft dome euro tweeter. But they address something that few speakers can.

Because the tweeters are high in the dash and the midbass drivers are fairly low in the doors it is hard to get any degree of coherency, particularly on vocals. Because the tweeters are so high comparatively they tend to bite (harsh edge). Because the midbass drivers are low their upper midrange response tends to roll off early and aggressively. This leaves a hole and further accentuates the tweeters' bite.

The JL Audio C3 components feature a separate passive crossover network with four levels of tweeter attenuation plus three levels of midrange crossover tiers. Between these two options you can come very close to completely compensating for the speaker positions.

Without these features, speakers that cost twice as much and are true upgrades will not sound nearly as good.

It requires some experience and an educated ear to get the full benefit of the C3 speakers. So you may want to enlist a local pro who is very familiar with the routine.

The construction of a 6X9 to 6.5 adapter for both doors will be necessary. It's important to have a rigid mount with airtight front to rear acoustic isolation, at least in the proximity of the speaker. It's also helpful to construct the adapter to push the speaker outward as far as possible towards the rear of the door panel grill without making contact when under excursion.

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Got one price during lunch for a stereo system upgrade with install, here is what they quoted (had JL C2's but no C3's in stock, guy advised against the C2's but didn't say why):

Alpine Power Pack Amp

Alpine 6x9 Type S (front doors)

Alpine 6.5 Type E (rear doors)

Pioneer Soft Dome Tweeters

Raptor 4 Gauge Amp Kit (for my subwoofer I have)

PAC Stepdown

All installed with tax @ a little over $1k

I will see what the other shop has and recommends possibly Saturday. This is why I asked the crew because I have no idea about any of this stuff. Thanks for the input that you have already given me, it is greatly appreciated!

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I am so very much not a fan of putting a coax in the door and then adding a tweeter to the dash. Much better to have dedicated component set with a crossover network designed for it as a system.

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I am so very much not a fan of putting a coax in the door and then adding a tweeter to the dash. Much better to have dedicated component set with a crossover network designed for it as a system.

I was a little disappointed in the selection at this store, but stereo is not it's main thing I do not think. It's more of a tint and aftermarket accessories place for bed covers, seat covers, alarms, toolboxes, etc. The next place I am going is more of just an audio store so hopefully it has more to choose from. I have to admit though, it has been so long since looking at stereo equipment, that I am in sticker shock a little, lol! On the drive back with the truck I had in my mind that for $300-500 I could have a decent stereo, but have learned since then that the B.O.A.T. acronym applies to trucks too, lol!

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jw,

jk13 has led you down the right path.

I also agree that the front speakers in that vehicle (and every vehicle is different) should be the top priority as to how you allocate your budget. From the driver & front passenger perspective the rear speakers are low and blocked by the front seats so they are fill-in at best. You, as the driver, won't get any SQ or articulation from the rear door location even with an outstanding speaker. The benefit of rear door speakers will be primarily for the rear occupants in this case.

Supplementing the front door coaxial speakers with an ambience tweeter atop the dash can work if the shop really knows how to do it. Those secondary tweeters need to be attenuated to the point that they lose all localization. In other words they sound best when you are unaware of their presence....until they are gone. When doing this I also like to move the crossover up a bit and above the vocal range. I wouldn't trust many to get that right.

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Found two sets of C3 650's so guess I could do front and rear doors and also found a JL XD700/5 that a friend has, can this amp power the 2 MS-10SD2 subs sufficiently or would I be better running two amps (the one I already have and the XD700/5)?

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If I get the JL XD700/5 with the specs below does it mean that if I am pushing 2 subs in a box that they are each only recieving 150 watts RMS?

Highlights of XD700/5:
  • 5-channel car amplifer
  • 75 watts RMS x 4 + 180 watts RMS x 1 (at 4 ohms)
  • 100 watts RMS x 4 + 300 watts RMS x 1 (at 2 ohms)
  • 200 watts RMS x 2 bridged at 4 ohms + 300 watts RMS x 1 at 2 ohms

With the power handling of 300 watts RMS per sub, does that make them underpowered?

Trying to figure out all this terminology for 2 ohm, 4 ohm, bridged stuff I am seeing.

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That is correct and you can wire a pair of D2 subs at 2 ohms. If you look at JBL's spec sheet on that sub the RMS rating actually varies from 250-600 using the different "standard" testing procedures. At this point it's personal preference on how much power you want vs. ease of installation and cost. I run a JL 500/5 in my wife's truck, which is 250 on the sub channel to a woofer that is rated for 500 RMS and we've consistently run 1000 to in the past. It does what we need it to, but not what it is capable of. Severely underpowering a woofer leaves a lot of performance on the table, and most times you'd be better off with one that is closer to your amp's power rating. Less powerful woofers usually have less mechanical mass to move and/or softer suspensions so they'll give more output with less power. Again, personal choice on what to do here, just giving the typical differences.

"Standard" seems to still vary wildly from one manufacturer to the next. JBL's Power handling numbers are some that I think can be trusted, depending on which "standard" you choose to look at.

Peak...........................1,200W
Continuous music1.........600W
NBR2............................300W
AES3.............................250W
NBR Standard (10,303 Brazilian Standard).
AES3 Standard (60Hz – 600Hz). (Most run subs 20-60Hz or 80 at the highest in your application)
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Looking at a few other alternatives for one amp that will do everything to keep the wiring simple and ran across this (subs 500 RMS puts me closer to subs max 300 when ÷ btwn 2 subs):

http://www.onlinecarstereo.com/CarAudio/p_32482_Rockford_Fosgate_P1000X5D.aspx

I do have a 1 channel amp already for the sub so I guess I could just have them wire up 2 amps if needed or I could get one of those inline booster pack amps for the doors I guess like the first shop recommended?

Next question, when coming straight from a stock head unit, do I need a LOC or something to help the sound, if so what would you suggest?

Is there a difference in all the amp install wiring kits I see with prices all over the board? Which single amp and which dual amp kits are best?

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Concerning the LOC or similar processor coming out of the HU, I am not familiar with the factory Tundra HU. But you should speak with a mobile electronics dealer who does know that OEM HU very well.

Many factory HUs change the response as the volume increases. So you can only dial in the system at its best over a very narrow portion of the HU's control. If this is the case with the Tundra it will be impossible to get the best sound quality without an external processor of some type that allows you to fix the HU in the sweet spot and provides a more linear volume control with a flat response. Audio Control may fix the issue a little differently. Whether a JL Audio Clean Sweep, Audison bit processor, Audio Control, or another option, it is important that you go the route that your installer is very familiar with and can get it truly dialed in.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Finally made my decision on what I wanted and wanted to spend. Just like with a boat, upgrades get out of hand fast! Started off with a budget of > $1,000 and ended up around the $2k mark.

Here is a list of what I ended up ordering this week:

Front doors - CXS64 Image Dynamics

Rear doors - CTX65 Image Dynamics

Sub - Tundra Ported Box & Image Dynamics IDQ12

Exile Javelin Amp

ReCurve EZQ - TacoTunes (kind of like a LOC/EQ all in one)

1000w Amp Install Kit

Everything should be here today and hope to get it installed over the weekend. I will try to remember to take a lot of pics along the way and post up.

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My TacoTunes shipment arrived, now I have everything I need to start installing this weekend I hope, but really need to squeeze in some water time too on Saturday afternoon!

This is supposed to be a turn key installation, meaning they sent me everything I could possibly need (except tools), so hopefully it is not too terribly hard to install by myself. If it gets difficult, then I may have to call in some recruits to save me. I have a buddy that is into the competition stereo stuff and I know a Toyota mechanic so I think between all of us, it should not be a problem.

post-16917-0-80738200-1405112033_thumb.j

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  • 2 weeks later...

Got it installed, only took me a whole week by myself lol! I have to say, it is a huge improvement over the stock speakers in the truck. I have some fine tuning to do on the ReCurve (eq) but other than that, it sounds great.

Thanks for all the advice guys, greatly appreciate it.

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  • 2 years later...

Just a little update on this old thread, I repeated the process in my new Tundra Crewmax but it only took me a weekend this time even with installing some sound dampening to the back wall and doors.

I removed all the stuff before I traded in my truck and was able to use everything except for the sub and box from my '10 Crewmax.  The '10 had the rear seats that slid forward so a bigger box can fit.  That is definitely not the case for the newer Tundras.  My new sub box is really slim with dual ID10's.  It sounds really good.

Tacotunes has been great to work with and has been extremely helpful with both of the installs I did!

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