Poorman's Gate

[martinarcher]

So I did get to try a giant gate the other night. Honestly I had mixed results and I wish I could have spent more time trying it. I think we needed to play around with the weight distribution and speed more, because the same setup with a bigger gate didn't automatically produce better results on our boat. At first the wave felt bigger and stronger, but at the end we switched back and my buddy said he couldn't tell much difference. We had minimal people this time too, and I think were too heavy in the rear because even the normal gate wave we were used to seemed more washed out (softer) with more spray. MA -- let us know how cutting yours down works for you- and I'd encourage you to surf behind it as is, then swap and surf some more and see how it feels right after. Maybe you'll get different results.

1) I would like to change my previous answer about turning. I simply could not turn the boat with any speed when the BIG gate was deployed on the opposite side. Now I know what MA was talking about with his. It's a little difficult with the regular size gate (when open, since mine is manual open-close not automated with actuators), but with a big gate it was ridiculous.

2) My opinion after a real quick trial, a big gate that diverts more water could be better but you still have to play with weight and speed more to know for sure. I personally don't think you'll ever see a 30% improvement or anything crazy. I think it'd be more like 10-15% better at most... which could still be a lot but like I said it also made our boat handle a lot different. I think weighting your boat properly with whatever you have is the best fix anyway.

I've put about 12 hours or more with our standard sized gates. I think I'm sticking with them for now, especially for the drivability. If someone comes up with a better shape or solution --- I'll say thanks and swap gates! Curious to see what's in store in the coming years

Cool deal. Glad you got to try out a big gate. I told you the steering sucks. I still can't believe my wife got it on the trailer without me pulling it off the boat.

I wanted to do what you said, run the boat with the big gate and then run it with a smaller one back to back, but short of taking the tools to the lake and cutting it there I figured I would have a good idea trying the back to back weekends. Tonight I took 5 inches off the top of my gate and cut it down to 10 inches high. It is about 1/2" above the platform now. I'm going to try it tomorrow and see what happens. I'm wishing I had hinges mounted already so I could just bolt on different gates!

I ordered some materials for building permanent gates. I'm pretty sure the swim platform mounts are too wide on my boat to get the gates "stowed" far enough. I think I'll have to move them in or at the very least change them to angle toward the center of the platform a bit. I still need to order hinges and actuators.

[martinarcher]

Throw away the 2X4's and bite the bullet. Pick your size below, replace the metal tabs with HDPE, get a set of switches on the same page or order Carling type switches and be done with it.

http://www.wholesale... Trim Tabs.html

I was so close to doing that until I made up some cardboard gates and looked at how the gate moves on the transom of my boat as it swings on the hinge. With the compound angle (transom angled back and side of the boat angled in), the back of the gate changes altitude big time as it swings through the range of motion on the hinge. I'm going to have to put steps or something on the back of my gate to get my hinge line vertical so my gate lines up with both the platform and the side of the boat.

[Ronnie]

I was so close to doing that until I made up some cardboard gates and looked at how the gate moves on the transom of my boat as it swings on the hinge. With the compound angle (transom angled back and side of the boat angled in), the back of the gate changes altitude big time as it swings through the range of motion on the hinge. I'm going to have to put steps or something on the back of my gate to get my hinge line vertical so my gate lines up with both the platform and the side of the boat.

To be expected. Possibly why the Factory platform is cut out to allow the gate assy to be moved inboard.

[jkendallmsce]

If your not going to build it out of teak, check out baltic birch plywood. It's a lot higher grade than the normal stuff and I think it would last a bit longer.

You can buy sheets 4x8 of PVC or the same stuff the backs and bottoms of the seat cushioins are made out of.... seems to work better what attaching to a teak deck vs the newer fiberglas decks..

Edited September 1, 2012 by jkendallmsce

[Ronnie]

You can buy sheets 4x8 of PVC or the same stuff the backs and bottoms of the seat cushioins are made out of.... seems to work better what attaching to a teak deck vs the newer fiberglas decks..

King Starboard? I keep some of that onhand for projects. I think the last I bought was 3/4'X12"X48". Seems like it was ~$40.

[martinarcher]

That stuff would work really well. I know rugger used something like that for his gates. It would be a lot easier to work with than stainless plate!

[Ronnie]

That stuff would work really well. I know rugger used something like that for his gates. It would be a lot easier to work with than stainless plate!

That's true, I use normal woodworking tools on it. Bandsaw, drill press and router work well with it.

[jkendallmsce]

King Starboard? I keep some of that onhand for projects. I think the last I bought was 3/4'X12"X48". Seems like it was ~$40.

I think there are hundreds of names for the stuff....used alot of it back when I was involved in retrofitting/updating clean rooms.

I don't remember what Malibu uses, but it replaced the pylwood backing for seats, etc. probably the same strength characteristics as plywood, just won't rot. I remember seeing sheets of it when I was at the Malibu plant years ago. So you could probably get 4x8 sheets of it??

Like someone said, you can use wood working tools to cut it.

Thick enough, it would work better than wood, and if you have to tools, it can be heated and bent to fit your needs.

[martinarcher]

That's true, I use normal woodworking tools on it. Bandsaw, drill press and router work well with it.

You have to love materials that are easy to work with!

[martinarcher]

Well I cut down my gate so that it is about 1/2" higher than the top of my platform and I cannot tell the difference when surfing. I had what seemed like just as much push and just as much length to the wave. From the board, the gate looked like it was pushing just was much water as before.

Here's a really cool review....

I had my parents on the boat tonight and my Dad loves to surf, but hasn't had much fun ropeless because he just can't get enough push off the wave on my Sunsetter. I knew the wave was much better than before now that I've added the gate, but was curious what he would think since he's not out too much and surfs even less. First pull he comes out of the water and gets into the wave as it forms and immediatly the rope goes slack. He looks up with a big smile on his face and gives a thumbs up and throws the rope into the boat and proceeds to surf ropeless for several minutes! He probably took 6-8 pulls with great ropeless runs. He got back in the boat shaking his head. "I never thought that thing would do that!" "That thing works!" Now he's looking forward to the permanent solution since he experienced the drive-ability of the boat with the gate always deployed. I must say though, with the smaller gate the drive-ability was much better.

[G-Mack]

I might behind on this topic.... has anyone been playing with the poorman gate on a fibreglass platform?

Edited September 2, 2012 by G-Mack

[martinarcher]

Not that I know of. You going to be the first?

[wakebrdr94]

Have the gate, workin on attaching it

[G-Mack]

Not that I know of. You going to be the first?

.........

[pielet97]

Ok, I'm sold. I haven't checked the site for a little while, so I'm stoked! I'll have to start thinking about the fiberglass solution....

[nevertwobig]

Well I cut down my gate so that it is about 1/2" higher than the top of my platform and I cannot tell the difference when surfing. I had what seemed like just as much push and just as much length to the wave. From the board, the gate looked like it was pushing just was much water as before.

Here's a really cool review....

I had my parents on the boat tonight and my Dad loves to surf, but hasn't had much fun ropeless because he just can't get enough push off the wave on my Sunsetter. I knew the wave was much better than before now that I've added the gate, but was curious what he would think since he's not out too much and surfs even less. First pull he comes out of the water and gets into the wave as it forms and immediatly the rope goes slack. He looks up with a big smile on his face and gives a thumbs up and throws the rope into the boat and proceeds to surf ropeless for several minutes! He probably took 6-8 pulls with great ropeless runs. He got back in the boat shaking his head. "I never thought that thing would do that!" "That thing works!" Now he's looking forward to the permanent solution since he experienced the drive-ability of the boat with the gate always deployed. I must say though, with the smaller gate the drive-ability was much better.

So what is the actual size of your gate and how much ballast? Do you have a picture of the new setup?

[martinarcher]

The gate is about 10" high and about 22" long. It's longer on the bottom edge (about 25") since it is cut to fit the angle of the transom. I'll get some pics today for you.

[nevertwobig]

Thanks alot!

[martinarcher]

I missed you question about ballast. We've been running 400 lbs on the non-surf side and about 600 on the surf side (or whatever it takes to get the bottom of the rub rail almost wet underway while surfing).

Here's a video from Sat.....

[jkendallmsce]

I missed you question about ballast. We've been running 400 lbs on the non-surf side and about 600 on the surf side (or whatever it takes to get the bottom of the rub rail almost wet underway while surfing).

Here's a video from Sat.....

MArtin, I thought you could run the gate w/o any ballast? I guess I missed that along the way. So for my LXI, I will still need to run the wedge down? I know you have not tried it on a LXI, but you'll need either ballast or the wedge down to get er to work?

[martinarcher]

Yep. Not a substitute for ballast, you just don't need to list the boat nearly was much as before. I run the above mentioned ballast and out wedge. I would guess a good starting point for your LXI would be 600lbs on either side of the engine and the wedge down. Add list until happy.

[jkendallmsce]

Yep. Not a substitute for ballast, you just don't need to list the boat nearly was much as before. I run the above mentioned ballast and out wedge. I would guess a good starting point for your LXI would be 600lbs on either side of the engine and the wedge down. Add list until happy.

Still good, but I was all giddy thinking I could surf w/o using/employing the wedge...cause the gas tanks empties alot faster when the wedge is down....kinda like draggin an anchor.

It will be nice to surf in clean water, rather the turbulance that I have now.

[martinarcher]

I think you'l be able to surf wedgeless. I her you on the gas it chews up. I'll have to try the gate without the wedge, but I could surf before without it without much trouble at all if I added just a bit more weight.

[Levi900RR]

There is no replacement for displacement...

[jkendallmsce]

I think you'l be able to surf wedgeless. I her you on the gas it chews up. I'll have to try the gate without the wedge, but I could surf before without it without much trouble at all if I added just a bit more weight.

When I get back, I am excited about trying out a few thoughts I have and yours...I have the fiberglas deck...and would never hear the end if I mucked it up...even if it was on the underside. ANd I 'll play with adding a few pounds to the stern at a time...I have little cubes made up...each weighs about 10-15 pounds, and I can move them around to tweak.